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(Before and After - because I love photoshopping evil stuff like this )
Letting gay people teach kids is "grooming" them to turn gay;
Letting cross-dressers hold kids' story hours is grooming them to become transvestites;
...and letting kids watch videos like this is grooming them to become FURRIES!!!
(I mean, why shouldn't we increase our numbers by seducing kids since as we all know, furries can't reproduce so they steal our children instead!)
The last one was an actual anti-gay argument at some point, and essentially it still is in different words.
CAUTION: PLEASE DON'T POST THIS PUBLICLY or the reactionary bigots who also hate furries will get hold of it and have a new threat/menace to peddle now that people are getting bored with litterbox (cat)shit.
Letting gay people teach kids is "grooming" them to turn gay;
Letting cross-dressers hold kids' story hours is grooming them to become transvestites;
...and letting kids watch videos like this is grooming them to become FURRIES!!!
(I mean, why shouldn't we increase our numbers by seducing kids since as we all know, furries can't reproduce so they steal our children instead!)
The last one was an actual anti-gay argument at some point, and essentially it still is in different words.
CAUTION: PLEASE DON'T POST THIS PUBLICLY or the reactionary bigots who also hate furries will get hold of it and have a new threat/menace to peddle now that people are getting bored with litterbox (cat)shit.
Category All / All
Species Rabbit / Hare
Size 1050 x 717px
File Size 209.8 kB
Is it "grooming" if it's objectively true? It is better being a bunny!
The litter box thing was always an attack vector against trans people. Getting people used to rejecting the words "identify as", used in discussion of transgender issues. Make the "fight" all about "protecting the sanctity of the bathrooms" by inventing a scenario that doesn't exist.
Every idiot that peddled that rumor should have been laughed out of the room, and it should have been career suicide, but sadly it wasn't. They don't care whether what they're saying is true or not, truth means nothing to them. Nothing matters but their hate, it's the only thing they have.
The litter box thing was always an attack vector against trans people. Getting people used to rejecting the words "identify as", used in discussion of transgender issues. Make the "fight" all about "protecting the sanctity of the bathrooms" by inventing a scenario that doesn't exist.
Every idiot that peddled that rumor should have been laughed out of the room, and it should have been career suicide, but sadly it wasn't. They don't care whether what they're saying is true or not, truth means nothing to them. Nothing matters but their hate, it's the only thing they have.
Ah, I see you had to deal with the same gun fetishist who jumped to Human72's defense after he blocked me. Gotta love how people can be so triggered by "Maybe people shouldn't murder people" or "I don't tolerate bigotry or hate", and still think they are good people. (Also gotta love how they seem to honestly believe that the only reason someone would not want to support Agent Orange is out of "derangement". They can look at someone who's a convicted rapist, convicted of fraud, with a decades-long track record of the most reprehensible and disgusting behavior possible, and say WE'RE "deranged" for saying no thanks.)
Conservatives LOVE their Hierarchy. They consider things like bullying and abuse and oppression to be not just "acceptable", but praiseworthy and inevitable. They use terms like "natural order" and "the way of the world". They believe the only way the world can work is if a small group of people who are "better" than everyone else are recognized and placed on top, and allowed to take advantage of the "lesser" people beneath them, who can take advantage of those below them, and so on. It's why they love fascist strong-men, because it echoes their way of thinking and validates it. And why they feel the need to "tear down" anything that stands as an example of any other way of thinking.
Which also makes furries a target, as we are often socialist-leaning, wanting to band together to make sure everyone is taken care of. Kind and compassionate, born out of lives of being bullied and not wanting to see others treated that way, or dealing with economic hardship. We also tend to be proponents of equality, or at least meritocracy, similar to hacker culture. A gift culture, where social standing is primarily elevated by the things one creates and gives away, in the form of artwork and media posted for people to enjoy. But even the top artists aren't above the rules of fairness, aren't allowed to bully people, without quickly developing a reputation as being a total jerk and losing segments of their fanbase.
Conservatives LOVE their Hierarchy. They consider things like bullying and abuse and oppression to be not just "acceptable", but praiseworthy and inevitable. They use terms like "natural order" and "the way of the world". They believe the only way the world can work is if a small group of people who are "better" than everyone else are recognized and placed on top, and allowed to take advantage of the "lesser" people beneath them, who can take advantage of those below them, and so on. It's why they love fascist strong-men, because it echoes their way of thinking and validates it. And why they feel the need to "tear down" anything that stands as an example of any other way of thinking.
Which also makes furries a target, as we are often socialist-leaning, wanting to band together to make sure everyone is taken care of. Kind and compassionate, born out of lives of being bullied and not wanting to see others treated that way, or dealing with economic hardship. We also tend to be proponents of equality, or at least meritocracy, similar to hacker culture. A gift culture, where social standing is primarily elevated by the things one creates and gives away, in the form of artwork and media posted for people to enjoy. But even the top artists aren't above the rules of fairness, aren't allowed to bully people, without quickly developing a reputation as being a total jerk and losing segments of their fanbase.
All so true.
And yeah, I know. I deal with those folks all the time. There are more than one of them and other rightists replying to that journal, and on Mel's followup to this there are yet more of the same ilk. They all show up on each other's journals and most of them are old time greymuzzles. One funny thing is that I'm older than most or all of them. At this point over thirty of the same gang have blocked me for being a lefty. I've never said an an unkind word to any of them, -or at least not unless they did that to me first- and many of those I've never even communicated with at all. Meanwhile I've never blocked anyone and never will.
Some of these same people were recently eulogizing an old time furry artist, Mitch Beiro, who just died after doing ten years in prison for collecting and distributing thousands of images and videos of child sexual abuse with kids as young as toddlers, and who likely engaged in that himself at least once. You can look him up on Wikifur.
You wouldn't believe the lengths and tortured logic that some of these people went to to defend this guy when I had the temerity to suggest that it was important to acknowledge the guy's bad side. One of them that I considered a friend even blocked me for that.
And yeah, I know. I deal with those folks all the time. There are more than one of them and other rightists replying to that journal, and on Mel's followup to this there are yet more of the same ilk. They all show up on each other's journals and most of them are old time greymuzzles. One funny thing is that I'm older than most or all of them. At this point over thirty of the same gang have blocked me for being a lefty. I've never said an an unkind word to any of them, -or at least not unless they did that to me first- and many of those I've never even communicated with at all. Meanwhile I've never blocked anyone and never will.
Some of these same people were recently eulogizing an old time furry artist, Mitch Beiro, who just died after doing ten years in prison for collecting and distributing thousands of images and videos of child sexual abuse with kids as young as toddlers, and who likely engaged in that himself at least once. You can look him up on Wikifur.
You wouldn't believe the lengths and tortured logic that some of these people went to to defend this guy when I had the temerity to suggest that it was important to acknowledge the guy's bad side. One of them that I considered a friend even blocked me for that.
Oh yeah, they love to accuse people of blocking them "For no reason" or "because they can't handle a bit of discussion", but Human72 blocked me (and then posted a journal about how awful and deranged I am (and despite "having no problem with" trans people and pointing to all their favorites of TG/TF stuff, repeatedly misgenders me at every opportunity in that journal)) first.
I try to deal with them with compassion, but it's hard to have patience when I've seen the same dance play out over and over and over again. They spew a bunch of lies and BS, I go through and show them facts that show what they are saying is wrong, and they call me things like stupid, hateful, lying, insane, misinformed, and worse. And then they spew a new set of lies and BS. They never once actually look at anything I say, because it doesn't line up with what they want to believe. Any evidence that proves them wrong is dismissed as "clearly librul lies and bias", so they don't even look at it, even when it's direct from Glorious Leader's mouth. And they accuse me of sticking my head in the sand and living in an echo chamber and wrapping myself in nothing but propaganda.
Nothing but projection, from all of them. They never once engage in any conversation in good faith. All they are after is conformity, bending the knee, blind obedience and worship of their dictator. They follow him because he legitimizes their hatred, he does everything they want to do. They're as utterly devoid of morals as he is. So I'm not at all surprised that they would fall over themselves to defend an actual child predator (while also still claiming trans people are groomers and worse). Hypocrisy is their bread and butter.
As for Beiro, I fully believe the mental gymnastics. These people divide the world into "Good People" and "Bad People". Good People do Good Things, Bad People do Bad Things. Being a Good/Bad Person is intrinsic, an innate quality. A Thing is Good if it's done by a Good Person, and Bad if it's done by a Bad Person, even if it's the same act. They think they are Good People, so everything they do is Good, by definition. So it's Good for them to abuse people, commit fraud, storm the capitol, or molest children. And it's Bad for us to breathe air or be seen outside. They do the same thing with their leaders. "He didn't say that. And if he said it, he didn't mean it. And if he meant it, you didn't understand it. And if you understood it, it's not a big deal. And if it's a big deal, others have said worse." And usually followed up with "Besides, you deserved it/It's just the truth".
They can't be reasoned with, when they're this far gone. At this point, I generally only interact with them at all when I can do so publicly, so anyone on the fence watching can see the two sides and make their own decision who to follow. I can show my kindness, I can show that I am willing to back things up with facts and evidence, I can show my beliefs... and they can show their bitterness and anger and hypocrisy and double standards and childish insults, since I've never seen them show anything else.
At 42, I'm not the oldest around, but I'm old enough to have watched this happen again and again. I've had countless "discussions" and "debates" with these people, and it's only been getting worse these last eight years. I miss the times when the mask was still on, when racists and bigots remembered that these were BAD things to be. Maybe some day, it'll be that way again, and society can go back to making progress instead of having to deal with redcaps who want to soak their hats in our blood.
I try to deal with them with compassion, but it's hard to have patience when I've seen the same dance play out over and over and over again. They spew a bunch of lies and BS, I go through and show them facts that show what they are saying is wrong, and they call me things like stupid, hateful, lying, insane, misinformed, and worse. And then they spew a new set of lies and BS. They never once actually look at anything I say, because it doesn't line up with what they want to believe. Any evidence that proves them wrong is dismissed as "clearly librul lies and bias", so they don't even look at it, even when it's direct from Glorious Leader's mouth. And they accuse me of sticking my head in the sand and living in an echo chamber and wrapping myself in nothing but propaganda.
Nothing but projection, from all of them. They never once engage in any conversation in good faith. All they are after is conformity, bending the knee, blind obedience and worship of their dictator. They follow him because he legitimizes their hatred, he does everything they want to do. They're as utterly devoid of morals as he is. So I'm not at all surprised that they would fall over themselves to defend an actual child predator (while also still claiming trans people are groomers and worse). Hypocrisy is their bread and butter.
As for Beiro, I fully believe the mental gymnastics. These people divide the world into "Good People" and "Bad People". Good People do Good Things, Bad People do Bad Things. Being a Good/Bad Person is intrinsic, an innate quality. A Thing is Good if it's done by a Good Person, and Bad if it's done by a Bad Person, even if it's the same act. They think they are Good People, so everything they do is Good, by definition. So it's Good for them to abuse people, commit fraud, storm the capitol, or molest children. And it's Bad for us to breathe air or be seen outside. They do the same thing with their leaders. "He didn't say that. And if he said it, he didn't mean it. And if he meant it, you didn't understand it. And if you understood it, it's not a big deal. And if it's a big deal, others have said worse." And usually followed up with "Besides, you deserved it/It's just the truth".
They can't be reasoned with, when they're this far gone. At this point, I generally only interact with them at all when I can do so publicly, so anyone on the fence watching can see the two sides and make their own decision who to follow. I can show my kindness, I can show that I am willing to back things up with facts and evidence, I can show my beliefs... and they can show their bitterness and anger and hypocrisy and double standards and childish insults, since I've never seen them show anything else.
At 42, I'm not the oldest around, but I'm old enough to have watched this happen again and again. I've had countless "discussions" and "debates" with these people, and it's only been getting worse these last eight years. I miss the times when the mask was still on, when racists and bigots remembered that these were BAD things to be. Maybe some day, it'll be that way again, and society can go back to making progress instead of having to deal with redcaps who want to soak their hats in our blood.
how DO you prefer to be gendered? -Not that I ever expect to be talking about you behind your back...
Yeah I hear these folks whining about lefties blocking them all the time. I'm certainly not one of those. There is a spectrum of these people. some are worse than others, but at this point most of them are at least tacitly supporting fascism, many of them for completely cynical reasons. I can see no excuse for this, considering how straight-up evil and dangerous fascism is. Never again is no fucking joke.
At this point I'm way beyond expecting most of them to have good faith discussions or arguments, or to listen to facts or change their minds. often as not they completely avoid things I say, even when I return to the same points repeatedly. A couple of great examples of that would be with Wollypegger at the top of this recent journal by Karno, king of the gun nuts and clueless libertarian nutjob: https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/10850014/ Notice how Wollypegger repeatedly ignores my questions and points. Most amusing there is how he ended up deleting all of his comments. Also notice how Mel and I trash Karno's faulty logic and wet dream fantasies of armed opposition to some imagined tyrannical US state here.
Another prime example of mental gymnastics and the eliding of questions is with the "Discussion" that I had with Karno on Schirm's journal about Beiro here: https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/10809329/
In particular notice how he completely ignores my question to him about how he'd feel if he found out that someone was distributing pics of him being sexually abused as a child. I'd still love to see an honest answer to that from him, but that's not likely.
The idea of hierarchy and conformity are definitely a key to most of these people's personalities, as well as a distinct fear of change and anything different, and a nostalgia for an imagined "Better Time" that never existed where white men ruled everything.
Insults and faulty logic are all most of the worst of these people have to offer, and despite how I realize that I'm not likely to change their calcified minds, I still reply because I think it's important to show that there's well reasoned opposition to their garbage. It also sharpens my arguments. And, hey, you never know what small thing you say might have a positive effect on some random person that happens to notice it.
I've been watching and opposing this crap since I was a kid in the sixties during the US war on Vietnam. I think it's better when these people are unmasked. At least then you can see what you're dealing with. It's like what Malcolm X said about preferring the wolf to the fox.
Ultimately, I feel really sorry for these small minded people living their scared, angry, sad, little lives.
Yeah I hear these folks whining about lefties blocking them all the time. I'm certainly not one of those. There is a spectrum of these people. some are worse than others, but at this point most of them are at least tacitly supporting fascism, many of them for completely cynical reasons. I can see no excuse for this, considering how straight-up evil and dangerous fascism is. Never again is no fucking joke.
At this point I'm way beyond expecting most of them to have good faith discussions or arguments, or to listen to facts or change their minds. often as not they completely avoid things I say, even when I return to the same points repeatedly. A couple of great examples of that would be with Wollypegger at the top of this recent journal by Karno, king of the gun nuts and clueless libertarian nutjob: https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/10850014/ Notice how Wollypegger repeatedly ignores my questions and points. Most amusing there is how he ended up deleting all of his comments. Also notice how Mel and I trash Karno's faulty logic and wet dream fantasies of armed opposition to some imagined tyrannical US state here.
Another prime example of mental gymnastics and the eliding of questions is with the "Discussion" that I had with Karno on Schirm's journal about Beiro here: https://www.furaffinity.net/journal/10809329/
In particular notice how he completely ignores my question to him about how he'd feel if he found out that someone was distributing pics of him being sexually abused as a child. I'd still love to see an honest answer to that from him, but that's not likely.
The idea of hierarchy and conformity are definitely a key to most of these people's personalities, as well as a distinct fear of change and anything different, and a nostalgia for an imagined "Better Time" that never existed where white men ruled everything.
Insults and faulty logic are all most of the worst of these people have to offer, and despite how I realize that I'm not likely to change their calcified minds, I still reply because I think it's important to show that there's well reasoned opposition to their garbage. It also sharpens my arguments. And, hey, you never know what small thing you say might have a positive effect on some random person that happens to notice it.
I've been watching and opposing this crap since I was a kid in the sixties during the US war on Vietnam. I think it's better when these people are unmasked. At least then you can see what you're dealing with. It's like what Malcolm X said about preferring the wolf to the fox.
Ultimately, I feel really sorry for these small minded people living their scared, angry, sad, little lives.
I'm a trans girl and pretty open about it, so I prefer she/her. (All three of my story series feature female protagonists, all of which were born as male humans, because they're all basically self-inserts. Princess didn't know she was trans before ending up a dragon, Flopsy doesn't remember being human or trans, and Vayryn was explicitly trans before becoming a yinglet and specifically mentions "Hey, I don't have to take HRT anymore, zhat's an up-side.")
Both of those examples are completely par for the course. I've never met a SINGLE one of these people who didn't start off "knowing" that they were Right and I was Wrong, meaning they didn't have to listen to a single thing I or anyone else said. I kind of wish I hadn't deleted them, but I had a string of notes on here from a Conservative where they kept putting out a spewing of "talking points", and I refuted each and every one with evidence, and almost never did they even acknowledge a single thing I said. When that person deleted their account, I deleted the notes.
I have exactly two people blocked on FA, after spending more than 18 years on this site. Both were blocked pretty recently. One's the transphobe who hangs out on Out of Placers pages and calls people like me "mutilated males". Older gentleman, but it makes me sad to share a Computer Science degree with him when he clearly doesn't believe in equality/meritocracy (since a keyboard doesn't care what hands are on it, all people are the same to it, all that matters is your own skill). And the other is the one who blew up at my "I don't debate Conservatives anymore" journal and tried to debate me. He blocked me first, so I blocked him back just in case he changes his mind and tries to start things back up again.
Like you said, I can't leave it unchallenged. If I don't act with Truth, Love, and Courage in my heart, I'm not being the person I want to be. I want to be someone who embodies Honesty, Compassion, Valor, Justice, Honor, Sacrifice, Spirituality, and Humility, and I can't be that person if I'm willing to avoid an argument by allowing falsehood and hatred to stand unopposed. (...Yes, I did basically steal the closest thing I have to a religion from an 80's/90's computer game series. Have I mentioned lately I'm a huge dork? ^_~ ) Sometimes I like to try to engage them on their own terms, reminding them that they're making their heart a home for Hate, rejecting God's Love for everything. It never works, of course, since none of them actually CARE about the Bible or what's in it (except whatever parts they can use to prop up their bigotry). But I like to try.
I will freely admit there are some pretty crazy people on the left. Some extreme people who say things I strongly disagree with. But there's a difference, both in quantity and in reaction, to extremism on the Left and the Right.
What do Left-leaning people call their extremists? "Crazy."
What do Right-leaning people call their extremists? "Senator."
Both of those examples are completely par for the course. I've never met a SINGLE one of these people who didn't start off "knowing" that they were Right and I was Wrong, meaning they didn't have to listen to a single thing I or anyone else said. I kind of wish I hadn't deleted them, but I had a string of notes on here from a Conservative where they kept putting out a spewing of "talking points", and I refuted each and every one with evidence, and almost never did they even acknowledge a single thing I said. When that person deleted their account, I deleted the notes.
I have exactly two people blocked on FA, after spending more than 18 years on this site. Both were blocked pretty recently. One's the transphobe who hangs out on Out of Placers pages and calls people like me "mutilated males". Older gentleman, but it makes me sad to share a Computer Science degree with him when he clearly doesn't believe in equality/meritocracy (since a keyboard doesn't care what hands are on it, all people are the same to it, all that matters is your own skill). And the other is the one who blew up at my "I don't debate Conservatives anymore" journal and tried to debate me. He blocked me first, so I blocked him back just in case he changes his mind and tries to start things back up again.
Like you said, I can't leave it unchallenged. If I don't act with Truth, Love, and Courage in my heart, I'm not being the person I want to be. I want to be someone who embodies Honesty, Compassion, Valor, Justice, Honor, Sacrifice, Spirituality, and Humility, and I can't be that person if I'm willing to avoid an argument by allowing falsehood and hatred to stand unopposed. (...Yes, I did basically steal the closest thing I have to a religion from an 80's/90's computer game series. Have I mentioned lately I'm a huge dork? ^_~ ) Sometimes I like to try to engage them on their own terms, reminding them that they're making their heart a home for Hate, rejecting God's Love for everything. It never works, of course, since none of them actually CARE about the Bible or what's in it (except whatever parts they can use to prop up their bigotry). But I like to try.
I will freely admit there are some pretty crazy people on the left. Some extreme people who say things I strongly disagree with. But there's a difference, both in quantity and in reaction, to extremism on the Left and the Right.
What do Left-leaning people call their extremists? "Crazy."
What do Right-leaning people call their extremists? "Senator."
Once again, fully agreed.
Ah yes, the Catholic pedant on OOPs. He managed to enrage a number of trans folk with that as well as a number of people such as myself.
Catholic damage is real, and the effects are deep and lasting, even with people like my ex GF, who escaped its direct clutches when she was five, but is the first to admit that it damaged her for life.
Re: the rightists, I could never be so sure of myself, at least not without confirmable facts to back me up. I grew up being way too skeptical of everything for that to ever happen. The sheer credulousness and gullibility of so many of these people and their willingness to believe the most preposterous conspiracies or crap that confirms their narrative is all that anyone with a single ounce of intelligence need to see to confirm that. That anti furry panic is a perfect case in point.
I don't believe in any of the old tired ideas of a God created in our image, but I find religion fascinating. I have my own concept of spirituality, (As everyone who claims one actually does). I believe in love and awe, for instance. I appreciate the basic things that are at the root of all religions that they have in common. The bible, for instance, is full of interesting stories, but they're so open to interpretation and contradicting of each other that anyone can cherry pick them or parts of them to confirm whatever they choose. So much cruelty, murder and evil have been done in the name of Christianity that it's mindboggling. Any kind of religious extremism is poison.
I also find myself disagreeing with people on the left, but that's usually either more minor points and pretty infrequent compared to those on the right, and not just because I'm a lefty myself. They're just not as patently loony, with extremely few exceptions. You don't see anywhere near as many of them claiming such ridiculous and loony shit. As an example, surely it's just a fluke that when a Dem (Who are hardly even on the left for the most part) misbehaves everyone including the Dems condemn them, but when a Rep misbehaves the Reps either try to ignore it or bend over backwards to make excuses for them.
Ah yes, the Catholic pedant on OOPs. He managed to enrage a number of trans folk with that as well as a number of people such as myself.
Catholic damage is real, and the effects are deep and lasting, even with people like my ex GF, who escaped its direct clutches when she was five, but is the first to admit that it damaged her for life.
Re: the rightists, I could never be so sure of myself, at least not without confirmable facts to back me up. I grew up being way too skeptical of everything for that to ever happen. The sheer credulousness and gullibility of so many of these people and their willingness to believe the most preposterous conspiracies or crap that confirms their narrative is all that anyone with a single ounce of intelligence need to see to confirm that. That anti furry panic is a perfect case in point.
I don't believe in any of the old tired ideas of a God created in our image, but I find religion fascinating. I have my own concept of spirituality, (As everyone who claims one actually does). I believe in love and awe, for instance. I appreciate the basic things that are at the root of all religions that they have in common. The bible, for instance, is full of interesting stories, but they're so open to interpretation and contradicting of each other that anyone can cherry pick them or parts of them to confirm whatever they choose. So much cruelty, murder and evil have been done in the name of Christianity that it's mindboggling. Any kind of religious extremism is poison.
I also find myself disagreeing with people on the left, but that's usually either more minor points and pretty infrequent compared to those on the right, and not just because I'm a lefty myself. They're just not as patently loony, with extremely few exceptions. You don't see anywhere near as many of them claiming such ridiculous and loony shit. As an example, surely it's just a fluke that when a Dem (Who are hardly even on the left for the most part) misbehaves everyone including the Dems condemn them, but when a Rep misbehaves the Reps either try to ignore it or bend over backwards to make excuses for them.
Also, notice that in Anywayas's interaction with me on Mel's journal about the furry crap that she never actually responded to my point about the difference between the right and the left. I would have loved to respond to whatever she actually said on that or to give more examples. But of course she chose to change the subject to whether I was a troll or not, because she knew how stupid she looked at that point and wasn't able to come up with a real counter to my argument. I've had the goalposts moved on me exactly like that so many times now by rightists that it's really laughable.
I'm not sure if this guy would agree with you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJinWua98NA
(Warning: downer ending)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJinWua98NA
(Warning: downer ending)
are there any zebras with horizontal stripes? Or...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSTGOyDFPrU
- rainbow ones?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSTGOyDFPrU
- rainbow ones?
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