Ooof... Yeah, the infamously bad F-104.

Sure, it was the first fighter jet to go Mach 2 in level flight, all the way back in the late 1950's, but it's terrible safety record, especially after the German Luftwaffe were conned... I mean, purchased a bunch of them in the 1960's as the USA's priorities changed for their fighter aircraft, is probably the main reason people remember the plane for.

Lovely illustration in any case. :)

It's terrible safety record was specifically because of the Luftwaffe, you've got it backwards. They took an airforce with no remaining knowledge base for fighter operations and zero experience with jets, let alone super sonic ones, and handed them a high skill mach 2 interceptor with a high take off speed and terrible low speed performance. A plane that explicitly outstripped performance of all previous aircraft by miles.

Then they overloaded it and used a high altitude interceptor as a low level, deep penetration nuclear bomber, literally the worst possible role for the plane.

Hence the reason why almost every other air force that operated it had a perfectly normal accident rate, only the Germans had problems with it.

Calling it a bad plane is like calling a Mini Cooper a bad car because it can't rock crawl. And people remember it for being bad the same way they remember the M4 Sherman for being a flaming death trap, it's just an old meme.

well, I drew it in the German colours, so it's accurate. Most German army death post-war were from flying this.

(Canadians I met also hold the Starfighter in regards as a dangerous plane to fly. The tiny wings provide no lift if the jet engine breaks, which apparently was quite an issue as you'd be flying what was essentially an enormous lawn dart.)

Indeed, but the problem is it's not dangerous so much as a risky plane, because it was built less than a decade into the jet age, there's a whole raft of tech that wasn't invented yet to make this thing more user friendly.

They asked for a mach 2 interceptor and they pushed the available tech till it bled. At the time everything that flew that fast was dangerous and difficult to fly, hence why everyone else trained for it.

An actually bad plane would suck at it's intended role and be dangerous not just risky. Risk is an understood threat, a plane with well understood issues that can be avoided with care. A dangerous plane would be one that goes out of control ot falls apart at random, without warning.

Everyone knew exactly when and how the Starfighter would fail and the Germans just ignored that.

and another mistake here: the luftwaffe HAD post war jet experience (the f104 scandal brought down the black tulip AKA erich hartmann who was the most succesfull fighter pilot in history and the WWII luftwaffe had the ME163 komet wich may have actually be the first plane to breach the sound barrier in level fligth). but most is accurate because the f104 was a great good weather interceptor but was pretty much not used as one. also the fact that its stall speed was extremely close to its landing speed wich should have made landing the f104 even more difficult than landing a flying boat or a me163 komet rocket fighter.

No no, conned was the right word.

Or bribed. That's also a good word. Lockheed was desperate to sell them after the US Air-Force got tired of them and canceled their orders with them.

x.x

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kV77GoRXHv4

"Dieses war seinerzeit das umstrittenste Beschaffungsprojekt der Bundeswehr. Intrigen und Bestechung waren damals vermutlich mit im Spiel, als dieses Flugzeug für die Bundeswehr beschafft wurde. Viel zu viele Abstürze kosteten 116 Piloten das Leben. Insgesamt verlor die Bundeswehr von 916 beschafften Flugzeugen 300 Stück, davon 269 durch Abstürze. Das war ein trauriger Rekord (!).
In diesem Film, den ich in den Jahren 1967-1968 mit einer alten Doppel-8 Kamera gedreht habe, erkläre ich das Flugzeug und zeige die Piloten-Ausbildung in den USA, die damals alle Starfighter-Piloten der Luftwaffe und Marine durchliefen. Ich nehme Sie in diesem Film mit auf Flügen über Arizona und lasse Sie spüren, wie solch ein ungewöhnliches Kampfflugzeug geflogen wurde.
Gruß, Wulf "Buddy" Beeck, ehem. Pilot 1.Staffel, MFG2, Eggebek"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wn5pIY-j2To

selten so gelacht...

Yeah. Those F-104s were horrible at low speeds.

And it's stall speed was also it's landing speed. So...

^.^

or at least commicaly close to it. its even more silly that the early astronaut trainign from NASA was done with it with that rocket engine handling trainer being likely the best version because it had wing extensions for the RCS thrusters giving it a bit more wiggle room during take of and landing.

Kinda like the opposite of the An-2?

Any landing you can be towed away from...

Time to tow him in a shed, may come handy.

Cerv do you take comms?

yep

Can i note you about prices and such?

Yes

Alright, note sent.

Lawn dart!

given enough thrust, even a brick will fly!

I prefer LuftWaffles

wow, thats a spicy meme.
I get the joke.
it is funny and very spicy.