Without the ND filter i fiddled as best i could with settings and decreased exposures and messed around with apertures and such and got this as a result. By the way this shot was taken hand held which is why i've uploaded it, i like to show the good aswell as what i would classify as not so good to show i need to improve :) that way you guys can see me improve (i hope) heh, but yes i'm going to revisit this place for sure with my lightweight tripod i'm hoping to buy and some decent filters in order to learn/improve