I read this in your journal. My comment: It cost him nothing but a little hope. It cost his father perhaps $1,000 (if they were worth that much back then).

I don't bemoan money that was never mine.

Back in '87 I don't doubt that 10,000 Pesos was worth about that. Remember, I bought under 200 Pesos for a US dollar in 1984. 10,000 then would have worked out to only fifty bucks. But a couple of years later there was a revaluation that replaced 50 old Pesos for one, or something like that. The New Peso would have been worth a lot more. At the same time the Canadian dollar my friend's Dad used to buy those Pesos was only worth something like 72 cents.

Back in the earily 80's I bought severial hundred Mexican One Peso coins for about five dollars. Then I drilled them so my wives could use them on their belly dance outfits. Jingly.

Now back in the early 70's Philippine Peso's were 7.5 to the dollar, so several hundred would have been too expensive.

Yeah.

In the late 70s Pesos were so worthless some coin arcades used them as tokens.

The reason was a 5 peso coin cost less than a brass token.

Mexican currency has gone through a cycle of having some substance to becoming outright toilet paper several times since the 70's. I think it probably began with the Oil Embargo. The cost of a barrel of oil has gone up and down like a yo-yo ever since, and Mexican solvency with it.

Well the current peso is about 13 pesos to the US Dollar... I am living in mexico now and I'm enjoying every moment of it....

Give it a few years and it might well be 270 to the Dollar, or 46, or 3,100...

Then again, perhaps history will be made and for the first time it will be so-many Dollars to the Peso. The Canadian Dollar was $1.10 US, fell a bit, and is threatening to go over its U.S. counterpart again.

So you want to talk about my country History? xD I will resume in one fucking word: CORRUPTION. The Mexican Government has always been since many years ago, much more than I was born into the corrupted system to serve your country. The Oligarchs, the groups of power here on Mexico, specially from the "extrem-right wing" has always sell this country in pieces to your USA government. Here on Mexico, is near to explode into a new civil war, a really bad massive blood bath 3rd revolution if the nowadays government of Feilpe Calderon from PAN (abbreviation of politic party called Partido Accion Nacional) and the nowadays corrupted but old and first politic party PRI (Partido de la Revolucion Institucional)...
The real devaluation of the "Mexico peso" against "US dollar" was in 1994 with the mother fucker Salinas de Gortari, and when they approved the fucking TLC (Tratado de Libre Comercio) or NAFT in english.

*to serve the country of USA .... I don't know if you are Canadian or from US xD sorry about that part... xD

From Canada -- that's why Mexico has always been something of a wondrement to me. I've very little first hand experience with the country or Mexicans. (We have lots of Cubans, but that's nothing like the same thing.)

Mexico has always been fucked over by the U.S. That much I do know. I don't think it's the only cause of corruption tough. I think the seeds of it are much older... they must go back to when Mexico was a colony of Spain, and stem from the sort of government Spain provided. It may have a lot to do with the way the land was settled, too, and why people came to New Spain from the old country. I have the impression that one reason was to get rich quick, and go back home to Spain. In the U.S. (and Canada) people tended to come to settle for life, and what they wanted was a farm, or a chance for a better job in a town or city.

But I'm making guesses. The only Mexican history I've read were short and only covered basic facts.

Yes exactly: The Good "Americans" (I prefer to call them USA people) and I guess most of the Canadians came to America because of the Monarchy on Europe. They were conservators of the despotic monarchy and oligarchy where people suffered while the rich pigs of the oligarchy enjoyed their damn lifes. The shit is iterative nowadays, because the Bad USA people followed them and destroyed most of the good things on the new continent.

Yes, USA fucked too much Mexico since 1845. Europe did it first but nowadays we have this "empire of terror" over our heads and we can't do anything because the government in Mexico is totally corrupted and manipulated by that empire. And the worst thing is that the people from USA is suffering with the same shit. LIES is the basis of this "empire".

And also we have like a kind of "damnation", we have been betrayed several times by idiots like Malinche or Santa Anna...

That is the one thing I've never been able to find in Mexican history -- a good leader. Maybe there were some, but it seems as though every "hero of the revolution" turned out to be just another tyrant. Which could be why Mexico has had so many revolutions.

I was in Mexico once, for an afternoon... if Tiajuana counts. Nobody tried to sell me their sister, at least, but me and my friend did get the trots from something we ate or drank.

Another friend of mine used to bridle because the people of the USA called themselves "Americans." I'd argue there was nothing else they could call themselves. There was already a Colombia so they couldn't be Columbians. There was already a British Columbia too (in Canada). Nor could they be United Statesians, since Mexico is the United States of Mexico. (Okay, Unidos Estados or something like that, but it means United States.) We thought and thought, but never could come up with anything that worked. Then, a little while ago I finally worked out what the citizens of the USA ought to be called. No... not idiots. "Atlantians!"

There has been good leaders.

1810 Independence from Spain, Examples of good Heroes are: Miguel Hidalgo, father of the independence or the "patria", Jose Maria Morelos, Vicente Guerrero and Agustin de Iturbide (this last one full spaniard just born in Mexico called "Criollos" to that "race").

1848 Santa Anna wasn't that bad, but we would never know why the fuck he really sold those northern parts of Mexico. Many people say that he did it because he was a bastard son of .... betrayer, but others have told that maybe he couldnt do anything that surrender because if they keep fighting USA troops would destroy the full country. They would have erradicated the Mexicans since they have had always the advantage since 1776, their independence was the first from all America.
Maybe the USA was part of a the master plan of aliens or who knows...

The Revolution of 1910: there was Francisco (Pancho) Villa and Emiliano Zapata the great Revolutionaries one from North and the other one from South.
Francisco I. Madero was gonna be the "good right wing" since he was a noble that wanted to stop the Tyranny of Porfirio Díaz. But he died and then there was the revolution but Pancho and Emiliano were just very ignorant to rule a Country, they had the "balls" or the guts or whatever they have to try to stop a tyrant and they did it. He was a real tyrant because he used even the kids to work on railroad construction and instead of making schools and teach them or at least pay them good enough to feed them but he never did. He and his "oligarchy" give all the fucking money to Europe specially France and to USA! And again USA shit government tried to intervene, take part again in a second or even third (I dont remember the full History) fight against Mexico but I really don't know what happend that they didn't. What I remember from what I read is that they fight but there was a part of NorthAmericans that didn't want to take part in a second unfair and injustice war against Mexico so they retreat.


USA people should be called USA people or USANS or whatever. I think Atlantians is far away from what they should be called. And Mexico should be called AZTLAN because Aztlan was the real city which the Aztecs where searching for.

And as I said I can't blame on the USA people, because their government sins... In fact what should happend nowadays is a big mass rise against this fucking governments when they try to mix our nations in one shit because the "oligarchy" (lets call all those fucking groups of power: masons, illuminati, aliens, opus day bush?, or whatever etc.) want to rule the world as a "matrix" and is not joke... they almost have done it... we are infront of a fucking PC or TV like idiots burning our brains...

"I want a COCA COLA AND A MC-TACO PLEASE" what a shit... thats unhealthy, I have been trying to waste all this grease I ate in all my life you know? I had severe gastro-intestinal problems some months ago because of that and my work and university hours, and because of stress suffered by the fucking shit news... Paranoid? Yea, I am probably.

Most of the "bad stuff" of this world is in us, yes But if you try to find a relation between them and the government you would be surprised of how ALL fix it... and how even the religions, civilizations, knowledge, constructions, etc. from past are related is very fucking weird and I guess you already know it...

If Diaz was a tyrant, why have I seen his face on Mexican coins? No comprendez. Villa seems to have been an ambivalent character, from what little I know of him.

Much as I can understand how a Mexican regrets selling what is now Arizona, New Mexico and California to the Americans, from my point of view it would be too strange if those places weren't American. As a Canadian there seems to be enough Latin America as there is, and it shouldn't take up a whole 2/3 of the New World.

Of course, one way Canadians distinguish themselves from the U.S. is that we have an Anglo-French culture, but the Yankees have a sort of Anglo-Hispanic culture. On reason American TV shows seem a little strange to me is because they have a Spanish speaking minority in the background, and its assumed to be "normal." But, of course, it's not normal in Canada, and seems foreign. (We have more Portuguese than Spanish speaking minorities, and most of our Spanish speaking Canadians are actually from Spain rather than Latin America. The rest are from Cuba.)

Canada has lost a little territory to the Americans as well, though not very much by comparison. Some border areas in New England, and a bit of the BC coast that borders the Alaska panhandle. The biggest loss were Oregon and Washington territories, south of Britich Columbia. They were British, but filled up with American squatters, who abruptly ran up an American flag. The British more or less shrugged and let it go. But those territories were lost before Canada's confederation. It would be nice to have some of those west coast states, though. Only a little of British Columbia is actually coast-line, and most of that is so vertical as to be useless. Our only livable Pacific coast is about 100 miles around the city of Vancouver.

As it was, it took a threat of war to prevent the Americans from taking the entire Pacific coast, from Alaska to the present U.S. border

Your question is not very intelligent, sorry, but is like asking "Why does Herodes king is on the coins if he killed many children"? Obviously, because he was the king as Porfirio Díaz was the President, both tyrants.

Villa is not an ambivalent from my point of view, he was heroe for Mexicans and of course is a villain for some USAs, because he was one of the few mexicans who fought them until his death. To be exactly, he fought the military and government forces. As I said, the bad government is always a yoke for the people and Mexico has had very bad corrupted governments like nowadays with FELIPE CALDERON, a betrayer for the nations making frauds, lies, illegal transactions and stealing money but no one can touch him because the "Oligarchy" is the "power" here... And is part of the USA government. Mexico can't create weapons of any kind, can't have their own real air force unless USA government wants. Mexico has low industry and companies of their own since the TLC (NAFTA) is for benefits of USA... thats why there are many FAT people there... but don't worry, now the "dog" (us the mexicans)
have been growing with the bad and unhealthy leftovers from the "master" (usa) so the dog is now fat too... only the government is "healthy" if you have seen... They invest a lot on their own health with the people's money if you have noticed... never mind thats another story but its part of the same thing.

And about those territories, I think it was more a CONQUEST by USA than just a "betray" by Santa Anna. But I don't regret at all because many countries with little territory have been great empires or great nations like Japan, Germany, and most of the European countries.

And yes, is normal that Canada has more Spanish Speakers from Spain than LatinAmerican (and thank God because I know how we are in our "bad" latinamerican culture, very different from the "good" latinamerican culture of course). Because first they have to cross all the USA territory and even more the 2 borders: one with Mexico and the second to Canada. Most of the mexicans and latinamericans going there is the "poor class" to stay forever or work, but also there are some exceptions in the "rich-class" and medium but just for business or vacations.

I would be glad to have a kind of European Union here on North America (MEX-USA-CAN) but the nowadays governments (At least from USA and specially Mexico) are very corrupted.

Obama lied for example: he said he would retreat the troops from Irak... he didn't and sent around 30,000 more soldiers and he got a Nobel Prize what an Ironic thing...

Calderon lied ... a lot! : he said he wouldn't rise the taxes... he raised them this year again. He said he would give a lot of employs like 1million per year... he lied, we have 2 million of unemployed people per year... and many shits from that shit president...

Sorry. I guess Diz was El Presidenté when the coin was made. I didn't guess that.

My ambiguity about Villa is probably because I hear both sides about him... but don't have a side of my own.

I could never see much point in Canada belonging to a Free Trade zone that involved Latin America. We just don't have much trade with anyone south of the Rio Grande. We buy some things, and sell a little to Latin American nations, but by the nature of things the amount of trade is small, and will likely always be small. Canada has plenty of raw resources and doesn't need to buy them from. We do buy some fruits and vegetables in the winter season when we can't grow them, but they can be bought from almost anywhere that's warm. Latin America makes few manufactured goods we don't make ourselves or get elsehwere. Nor can I think of anything much that places like Brazil, Argentina, or Chile would need from us. There's some stuff we sell to Mexico and South America -- possibly telecommunications technology (the "Blackberry" was developed in Canada, for instance). But Latin America is just not a majaor trading partner for us.

NAFTA and the idea of an American trading zone was just some American businessman's idea. No doubt the hoped to creat a captive market and supply of resources for themselves, that they could largely shut Asia and Europe out of.

Not many Americans like NAFTA either. While I don't think it's true, a lot of Americans lost their jobs in the Reagan/Bush era, and think those jobs went to Mexico!

Of course, that seems unlikely. While a lot of companies tried that, they usually failed to re-locate. If this wasn't so, why would there be high unemployment and poverty in Mexico? Why would so many Mexicans be sneaking illegally into the US?

Where the jobs really went, was mostly China and other Paciric Rim economies, which as nothing to do with NAFTA.

True, true. But who can deal with governments? xD I've been trying to make groups and its almost impossible since many people hast lost their proud to be part of the nation. Never mind this a long and hard theme as you know xD
Thanks for sharing, remember and discuss the real history of my nation. xD Hey and sorry, I am a total ignorant of your country's history :S you know we don't get used to know most of other nations history on schools here, because is even hard to know about us! :S and much harder when the government and groups of power try to modify the history for their convenience.

Canada has an interesting history, but we don't make much use of it ourselves -- unlike Hollywood, which promotes America like it was a fatty, fastfood hamburger. I hardly expect people who are thousands of miles away to have much knowledge of Canadian history if even most Americans, one step over a line on the map, don't know much about us.

I only know that your country was colony of French and British, and you got some few wars... thats all :S sorry but I guess is really better like that. Your country has proved that you don't need many years of war (like here) to get a good Independence and a healthy economy.
USA government meanwhile has proof that the war is a great benefit for them... but lies are even better.

While Canada has frequently sentt troops at the behest of the UN for "peace keeping" duties or as observers, officially we've had a fairly peaceful existence.

Despite that, Canadian troops have been involved in wars we weren't officially part of, such as the British war agains the Boers in South Africa, at the turn of the 19th. century. In this century, it's the American's who tend to think of Canada's armed forces as an auxilliary of their own. But usually we're reluctant to participate in any military exercise unless the UN says so. Canada had troops involved in the first Gulf War, with UN sanction, but not in the second Gulf War, which the US undertook on its own authority. There is some UN authority behind the current war in Afganistan as well,though the truth be told, there is little public support in Canada for our presence there.

Before we had an independent country the British were at war with the Americans between 1812 and 1815. During that time, much of the fighting was on Canadian soil. We won some, we lost some, and the war ended with a truce that restored everything the way it was before. Many Americans think they won the War of 1812, but it was a draw.

By act of Canadian Parliament, we were official belligerants in World War I and World War II. We were also officialy involved in the Korean War, by UN mandate.

If you want to discuss this topic further, it would be better to do it off FA -- my email address is

Taral[at]teksavvy.com

Is nice seen people interested and with knowlwdge at my people story!

I have one of those new! Perfect preserved in my coins collection during the transition at the new coin and bucks sistem for mexico 20 years ago!

I don't think most Canadians are happy with NAFTA either. Many of us feel that it exists only to guarantee we sell Americans the oil they want, and might someday supply them fresh water, when too many Americans live in desert places they shouldn't. We were obliged to allow goods and services into our country that not all Canadians wanted. Yet we never seem able to sell our manufactured goods to the States. Our franchises and services never seem to suceed. Most controversial was the increased access into our cultural -- American TV programs competing with Canadian programs, for instance.

We get the impression from Americans that culture is just another form of business to them, and if the Canadian identity can't compete with their's -- because their's is so much larger and better funded -- then too bad for us. The right thing to do, in their eyes, is to become more Amiercan. Eat more McBurgers, watch more "Survivor" and "Three's Company" on TV, listen to American rap music, follow NASCAR, and sell more hockey teams to cities in the US. None of this makes Canadians happy.

A past Prime Minister engineered this. His name was Brian Mulroney, and when he retired from poltics his popularity was next to zero. His party almost had no seats in Paliament after the next election. But we were stuck with NAFTA anyway.

The treaty supposedly established a board of arbiters to judge trade disputes. Several such disputes occured in the years after. In most cases the board found for Canada's side. But the US simply ignored the board's findings. Unlike Canada, the NAFTA treaty doesn't bind the US to anything. Congress can enact whatever laws it wishes, regardless of the treaty.

But at least not much Canadian industry moved to Mexico! A lot of Americans lost their jobs due to NAFTA, when certain businesses relocated south of the border to take advantage of cheap labour there. Many Amerians were shafted by NAFTA too.

All around, it was a bad treaty.

American here. NAFTA, in my opinion, was created for the sole purpose of making a handful of already obscenely wealthy Corporations and individuals even richer, at the expense of everyone else. The US government is just as corrupt as Mexico's, our politicians are just better at pulling the wool over the people's eyes.

The old saying goes that "cream rises to the top". Well, so does pond scum and I'm afraid that for a very, very long time that is what has been leading my country. Power, in and of itself, does not corrupt; it merely attracts inherently corruptible people. And I can see no real way of getting them out. They are too well entrenched. Vote them out? You'll just be replacing one for another of the same breed.