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Artwork (Traditional) / Doodle
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A Tremendous Pile of Stupidheads
Doodling. This is the result of last night, bleh. It was actually on 3 different pages, but i stuck them all together in PS so that maybe by their powers combined, they would only suck moderately.
As you can see by the bottom left corner, i was feeling pretty lame. Teh artistic lameness... unable to DO what i want to do. I want so badly to be able to draw comics, but i can't 'simplify' things... I'm locked up in Realism Penitentiary, sharing a cell with Bubba the Anthropig. Really all i'm good at is shading, and that doesn't mean shit, in the scheme of things.
Anyway, i was trying to work on expressions, because that's my biggest weakness... if you were to go through my gallery, there're really only a couple expressions i know how to draw, and that doesn't cut it. It really makes me feel like a waste of space, because it's holding me back. What good is a comic page if the characters are all made of cheap plastic?
Ok, i know you guys don't want to hear that shit. But, perhaps it might mean something to all you people who 'can't draw' ...i think i know how you feel - looking at art you love, wishing so hard that you could do your own, but not knowing how... it's so very frustrating, and it seems to maul one's confidence the way one of Michael Vick's pitbulls would rip up a cute cocker spaniel if they were penned up together.
...
Ok, anyway... I do really like that guy in the upper right, hehe. Though he is a failure, because i was trying to make him look insane and sadistic... but as always happens when i try that, it ends up looking like he just wants to play. ;_;
Those doodles on the lower right are ideas about a mask and hood for Noni... uh, it's safe to say Rorschach's influence has crept into me, in no small way. (But he's an awesome character, and badass too... so is that so hard to believe?)
I figure Noni might look good with a horsey skullface mask.
Dr. McNinja proves that one doesn't necessarily need a mouth and nose to convey good expression... the most important part is eyes and brows. Rorschach is a bit different, because he sort of does have a face, in a way... it's just really abstract. But it has the same effect, and we somehow can discern expression out of those blots (the fact that it works just proves how good Dave Gibbons' artistry is.)
One of the things i'm trying to do also is to make my cartoon equine faces more 'MLP' shaped... in other words, smoothed and simplified (though not quite as much as MLPs, heh) and shortened a bit - so i can base the head off of a sphere instead of having to draw a horse skull shape each time. (That's what i normally do when i'm working out facial features of equines, start with a skull.) It's a long road ahead. I have a couple of disembodied MLP heads, i should carry one with me for practicing the angles ...just as a rough guide, the way one would use one of those poseable figurines.
So... enough talk. Have some sketchcrap. *hands you a plate of it*
As you can see by the bottom left corner, i was feeling pretty lame. Teh artistic lameness... unable to DO what i want to do. I want so badly to be able to draw comics, but i can't 'simplify' things... I'm locked up in Realism Penitentiary, sharing a cell with Bubba the Anthropig. Really all i'm good at is shading, and that doesn't mean shit, in the scheme of things.
Anyway, i was trying to work on expressions, because that's my biggest weakness... if you were to go through my gallery, there're really only a couple expressions i know how to draw, and that doesn't cut it. It really makes me feel like a waste of space, because it's holding me back. What good is a comic page if the characters are all made of cheap plastic?
Ok, i know you guys don't want to hear that shit. But, perhaps it might mean something to all you people who 'can't draw' ...i think i know how you feel - looking at art you love, wishing so hard that you could do your own, but not knowing how... it's so very frustrating, and it seems to maul one's confidence the way one of Michael Vick's pitbulls would rip up a cute cocker spaniel if they were penned up together.
...
Ok, anyway... I do really like that guy in the upper right, hehe. Though he is a failure, because i was trying to make him look insane and sadistic... but as always happens when i try that, it ends up looking like he just wants to play. ;_;
Those doodles on the lower right are ideas about a mask and hood for Noni... uh, it's safe to say Rorschach's influence has crept into me, in no small way. (But he's an awesome character, and badass too... so is that so hard to believe?)
I figure Noni might look good with a horsey skullface mask.
Dr. McNinja proves that one doesn't necessarily need a mouth and nose to convey good expression... the most important part is eyes and brows. Rorschach is a bit different, because he sort of does have a face, in a way... it's just really abstract. But it has the same effect, and we somehow can discern expression out of those blots (the fact that it works just proves how good Dave Gibbons' artistry is.)
One of the things i'm trying to do also is to make my cartoon equine faces more 'MLP' shaped... in other words, smoothed and simplified (though not quite as much as MLPs, heh) and shortened a bit - so i can base the head off of a sphere instead of having to draw a horse skull shape each time. (That's what i normally do when i'm working out facial features of equines, start with a skull.) It's a long road ahead. I have a couple of disembodied MLP heads, i should carry one with me for practicing the angles ...just as a rough guide, the way one would use one of those poseable figurines.
So... enough talk. Have some sketchcrap. *hands you a plate of it*
Category Artwork (Traditional) / Doodle
Species Horse
Size 895 x 767px
File Size 224.3 kB
I think you nailed the "can't draw" description on the head. It's especially frustrating when you were fairly happy with your skill some months ago and then they suddenly dry up, either due to art-block or outside stress...still don't know where the hell they went...but i thinki i'm finally getting somewhere...
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I really like the third head down on the right side, he looks very surprised.
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I really like the third head down on the right side, he looks very surprised.
Yes, you did hit the nail on the head. You can only go so far with your incredible skill, then it drys up. I think someone once told me that erotic writing is a dead end. After awhile you've written about all the various ways of 'doing it' then what?
I personally would love to see a comic done in your photo realistic style. But to do so would be an incredible undertaking, and the danger of burn-out is very high. Vicky Wyman must have done that with her Xanadu series. The last 'Across Golden Seas' apparently was never finished, which is a pity, it's one of the best fur stories I've ever enjoyed.
Writing is something I've never mastered, although it can be learned apparently. At times we need help; I saw this this year when I started getting help for my art, and it's helping some. Just frustratingly slow though. Dr. Asimov had John Campbell as his mentor. Maybe that's the answer? Classes too?
- Shado
I personally would love to see a comic done in your photo realistic style. But to do so would be an incredible undertaking, and the danger of burn-out is very high. Vicky Wyman must have done that with her Xanadu series. The last 'Across Golden Seas' apparently was never finished, which is a pity, it's one of the best fur stories I've ever enjoyed.
Writing is something I've never mastered, although it can be learned apparently. At times we need help; I saw this this year when I started getting help for my art, and it's helping some. Just frustratingly slow though. Dr. Asimov had John Campbell as his mentor. Maybe that's the answer? Classes too?
- Shado
Oh, I know well the feeling. I *tought* I had learned how to draw the muzzle of a certain species or how humanoid arms/calves/torso/whetever are shaped... then I try to draw them from a slightly unusual angle, and suddely ZOMG I cannot draw any more. :-P Heads/muzzles are probably the best to get that kind of frustration.
I think that's where life drawing and photo references shot from unusual angles come in handy. Muzzles have extremely complex shapes and even artists with a good sense of volume like you may find it very hard to imagine a muzzle seen from really unusual angles using only the mind - especially if the muzzle is athropomorphized too and different from the original animal's. They are just more complex and ridden with subtle details than they look like. I guess that with much practice the shapes eventually fix themselves in memory to the point that even rotating muzzles comes out natural.
The expressions are very cute anyway.
I think that's where life drawing and photo references shot from unusual angles come in handy. Muzzles have extremely complex shapes and even artists with a good sense of volume like you may find it very hard to imagine a muzzle seen from really unusual angles using only the mind - especially if the muzzle is athropomorphized too and different from the original animal's. They are just more complex and ridden with subtle details than they look like. I guess that with much practice the shapes eventually fix themselves in memory to the point that even rotating muzzles comes out natural.
The expressions are very cute anyway.
When working with equines, it's also very important to remember that ears convey expression as well. I guess that goes for any animalistic-based drawing. Even having one ear lifted higher than the other can help convey a sense of curiosity, even if the eyes and brows have somewhat missed the mark. For instance, your fellow on the top there who is supposed to look insane, if you had flattened the ears back, it would be perfect.
You are too hard on yourself, hun. Then again, I think we all are to a degree. It's how we force ourselves to draw better, no? (Or just sit in a dark room while rocking back and forth in a borderline emotional collapse... Whichever happens first).
In truth, I know how you feel. I recently decided I want to stop doing the more cartoonish work and get into more realism, especially in regards to coloring. I just finished a piece that was completely lineless, and man, for a while there I wanted to throw my monitor because I thought it looked horrible. What I realized, however, is that the people we admire for such work have done it for years. While we envy their skill with something, others out there envy us for what we can do artistically. Your shading is stunning. Anyone who watches you can tell you this. But, I imagine it took lots of practice to get to that point? Even though you are familiar with art, it's safe to say that a new technique or style can (and sometimes should) take just as long to master.
*hugs* So don't feel down. These are very good! Your style shines through despite the fact they've been simplified. Just remember to tell yourself that you are still learning this style and shouldn't expect yourself to match the quality of comics that have been in progress for years. No matter the talent, no one can make up for raw experience.
You are too hard on yourself, hun. Then again, I think we all are to a degree. It's how we force ourselves to draw better, no? (Or just sit in a dark room while rocking back and forth in a borderline emotional collapse... Whichever happens first).
In truth, I know how you feel. I recently decided I want to stop doing the more cartoonish work and get into more realism, especially in regards to coloring. I just finished a piece that was completely lineless, and man, for a while there I wanted to throw my monitor because I thought it looked horrible. What I realized, however, is that the people we admire for such work have done it for years. While we envy their skill with something, others out there envy us for what we can do artistically. Your shading is stunning. Anyone who watches you can tell you this. But, I imagine it took lots of practice to get to that point? Even though you are familiar with art, it's safe to say that a new technique or style can (and sometimes should) take just as long to master.
*hugs* So don't feel down. These are very good! Your style shines through despite the fact they've been simplified. Just remember to tell yourself that you are still learning this style and shouldn't expect yourself to match the quality of comics that have been in progress for years. No matter the talent, no one can make up for raw experience.
As much as you're going to hit me for suggesting this, if I were in your shoes I would look at other animated horses (such as in Spirit: Stallion of the Cimmaron) and just sort of observe how they shortcutted things - not copy the style, but look at certain things, eyebrow placement, jaw and mouth shape and distortion, ears. I agree with the other suggestions that the ears especially should be more expressive. Toon faces distort the skull - you may wish to go way back to the real basics (like kindergarten basics) and start drawing expressions on little circle heads to really get a feel for them before returning to the horse surface. There are only 6 true expressions - check out this book here as a good reference and resource to some of the aspects which make them unique: http://books.google.com/books?id=YlIzCO5u30sC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_summary_r&cad=0
Don't be too hard on yourself. It's always hard to sally forth into unexplored realms, the mind is extremely resistant to change and loves habit, but it will be good for you long term to branch out. I look forward to seeing what you will come up with!
Don't be too hard on yourself. It's always hard to sally forth into unexplored realms, the mind is extremely resistant to change and loves habit, but it will be good for you long term to branch out. I look forward to seeing what you will come up with!
Yknow Ive been experimenting with software that analyzes video to determine camera motion (for seamless integration with CG content). Other folks have software that analyzes video of a rotating object to construct a 3d model.
I've always wondered if that software could turn a drawn character into a 3d model if the artist could draw it at a series of rotations well enough to keep the software from getting confused..
hmm. :)
I've always wondered if that software could turn a drawn character into a 3d model if the artist could draw it at a series of rotations well enough to keep the software from getting confused..
hmm. :)
I am usualy not doing much comments, but just that as a remark:
"Anyway, i was trying to work on expressions, because that's my biggest weakness... if you were to go through my gallery, there're really only a couple expressions i know how to draw, and that doesn't cut it"
To give horses expressions is not a easy thing, from a simple point of view. They are not able to make the same expressions as one just would expect from it naturaly by thinking about the usual human expression. Since that are almost the only expressions a human can read if you dont have the luck to spend years with animals.
Comments about horses can be read from certain artists about the animated Movie Spirit: The Mustang for example. Here it was said that they have spend more time on the characterization compared to movie characters of other earlier movies like The Jungle Book (if I remember correctly), cause eyes and other parts of the horse are extremly hart to conect with "human like" expressions. A simple lough performed in a way as most humans would imagine it would look anatomicaly uncorrect on a horse and has to be adapted to the anatomical quirk of the animal. A rather challanging task if you ask me.
So maybe to get some reference or ideas I would suggest to either watch the movie or search for the story boards, concept arts and such. The expressions and animations are just superb. Though I have no clue where one could find it on the net, but I would not be surprised if the DVD of the movie has a "making off". Though youtube can be a real help http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=884TRsBAQns
What ever if one likes Disney movies or not, but the artists are extremly talented no doubts about that.
"Anyway, i was trying to work on expressions, because that's my biggest weakness... if you were to go through my gallery, there're really only a couple expressions i know how to draw, and that doesn't cut it"
To give horses expressions is not a easy thing, from a simple point of view. They are not able to make the same expressions as one just would expect from it naturaly by thinking about the usual human expression. Since that are almost the only expressions a human can read if you dont have the luck to spend years with animals.
Comments about horses can be read from certain artists about the animated Movie Spirit: The Mustang for example. Here it was said that they have spend more time on the characterization compared to movie characters of other earlier movies like The Jungle Book (if I remember correctly), cause eyes and other parts of the horse are extremly hart to conect with "human like" expressions. A simple lough performed in a way as most humans would imagine it would look anatomicaly uncorrect on a horse and has to be adapted to the anatomical quirk of the animal. A rather challanging task if you ask me.
So maybe to get some reference or ideas I would suggest to either watch the movie or search for the story boards, concept arts and such. The expressions and animations are just superb. Though I have no clue where one could find it on the net, but I would not be surprised if the DVD of the movie has a "making off". Though youtube can be a real help http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=884TRsBAQns
What ever if one likes Disney movies or not, but the artists are extremly talented no doubts about that.
I think a big part of your problem with trying to get a lot of expression on a horse head is that horses have really subtle expressions. Their facial muscles don't really work in ways that a binocular-vision human would recognize as 'angry' or 'sadistic crazed'. I think if you give them more defined brows muscles, fudge your anatomy a bit, you might have an easier time.
All mine! *grabs the ponies and runs off laughing manically*
I love your style. Being anon-arty-type, I can't give you any useful advice other than don't be so hard on yourself. And yes, it is intensely frustrating, embarrassing and shame-inducing being unable to attempt even something basic.
I love your style. Being anon-arty-type, I can't give you any useful advice other than don't be so hard on yourself. And yes, it is intensely frustrating, embarrassing and shame-inducing being unable to attempt even something basic.
I could draw for years and possibly not match your skills *bows to them* And you really did hit it on the head when you talked about people who 'can't draw'. It's very frustrating even for those of us who think we're ok, until we start looking at stuff like yours (or Lightstep, Blotch, DarkNatasha, etc.).
You know, you called my art toony, yet I think it's almost the type you might wanna look at for a comic thing My only pointers would be (if you care to listen to a novice): SIMPLIFY. Look at overall shapes and try not to focus on details. EYES. Use slightly more toony eyes. Your eyes are uber realistic. Toony eyes are easier to use for expressions.
But really. You're too hard on yourself. Your specialty is realism. Take some time out to practice a different style. You can't master it in an hour. (I'm working it the other way. I'm starting toony and slowly trying to work my way toward realism as my head and hand start working together better).
Best of luck!
You know, you called my art toony, yet I think it's almost the type you might wanna look at for a comic thing My only pointers would be (if you care to listen to a novice): SIMPLIFY. Look at overall shapes and try not to focus on details. EYES. Use slightly more toony eyes. Your eyes are uber realistic. Toony eyes are easier to use for expressions.
But really. You're too hard on yourself. Your specialty is realism. Take some time out to practice a different style. You can't master it in an hour. (I'm working it the other way. I'm starting toony and slowly trying to work my way toward realism as my head and hand start working together better).
Best of luck!
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