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Life's A Chibi: The Professional VS The Hobbyist
This is a topic I wanted to talk about for a while. This image was inspired by the many people, both online and offline, who constantly complain and bicker about how high my prices are on my commission price sheet. They continuously point out that my artwork is not worth the amount I listed. Most times, they COMPARE their prices to mine and try to get me to tone down to almost their price range. They try to "help" me become a better freelancer and artist by hinting the fact that no one will buy my artwork because my prices are too high. They do this in my face and post comments in my journals, inserting a link to their art website with a "I can do these for a cheaper price -visit my page." comment. So after getting another individual artist who compares my "expensive" price to their one-digit price, I had to draw this.
I'm sure many artists have been in similar situations: someone randomly shows up to you and flat out says "Your prices are too high" or "That is to expensive" or "You should lower your prices so other people can buy your artwork." if you reject their idea on lowering your prices, they will mostly continue to reason with you and "explain" why you should or "you will regret it". It’s much like them saying: "Believe in this because your viewpoints are way out of proportion." And if you continue to deny them or take in their idea, you will get yelled at, told down and ( sometimes ), be ridiculed in public because they believe that “they are right and you, the artist are wrong.” This has happened to me several times.
There is difference between a Professional and a Hobbyist that some seem to miss often or don’t realize. The Professional is someone who makes a living off of the artwork they make day in and day out. Every day, they work on art in order to make their dues, such as bills, food, supplies, etc. The Hobbyist is someone who only works on art for extra change to buy small items and luxuries with little to no motivation or goal in becoming professional, or they do have that goal in becoming one but are not fully driven to uptake it as a career. It is mostly just to pass the time and to make a quick buck. Many times, people who draw only for a hobby try to get me to lower my prices and/or compare their prices with mine without any second thought and most times, it comes out insulting. Basically, they talk to me like my art life is just a hobby.
Artists prices vary depending on a lot of factors: their background experience, the materials they use, the time spent working on the piece, their fame ( supply and demand ), the economy, as well as the old quote You get what you paid for.
- Background Experience: A lot of artists go to school to learn about how to create and sell. They spend years learning how to sell, what will sell, how they can improve their skills and so on. They are educated on the Do's and Don'ts of the field so they become successful artists once they graduate.
Some artists don't go to school to learn about art. Some teach themselves and others are just born with the special ability to create. From what they learned first hand on selling their artwork and the art field itself, they grow and teach themselves what works and what doesn't in order to become an artist.
- Materials: Art materials don't come cheap. They can be rather expensive to purchase. Pens, pencils, charcoal, paper, boards, frames, clay, metal, etc. Some artists go for the cheap brands of tools while others go for more expensive brands. It doesn't really matter as long as the tools work in your favor. Artists use their money that they earned to buy art supplies to continue to help them create and grow. Tools die out and new ones need to be purchased.
This doesn't just connect to pens and brushes. This also connects to electronics and accessories, much like Wacom tablets, computer screens, hard drives, etc. Digital artists spend a lot of money on equipment they need to upgrade and improve their computers and applications that will aid in their growth as artists.
- Time spent on a piece: Depending on the art piece the artist is doing, it can take from 30 minutes to months just to complete. If it is a commission, they are using up their time and energy to create something that will be suitable for the client. This also factors in waiting times, approvals, sketches, travel, etc. The artist is using their own personal time to make something for someone else. Think of it as working as a job: you are being paid by the hour to do something for someone else.
- Fame ( Supply and Demand ): There are artists who grew in popularity from the art they do. The demands for more art and commissions grow. This means more time working. At this point, they can raise their prices because they know, from the amount of fans they accumulated, that they will buy the artist's work, no matter how much it costs. Sometimes it's not like that or that simple. One cannot inquire fame so easily. It takes time and years in order to get a good amount of followers/patrons/fans/clients from the art you created. The more business you get, the better the reason to slightly increase your prices. If the price becomes too high to the point of it being unreasonable or if business is slowing down because of it, then the artist should lower their price back down until the artist requires more business. The more your artwork gets out to the public, the more business you will get. This is a sign that your artwork is worth more than what you originally priced at the beginning.
- The Economy: Do I really need to get into this bit of detail? Money is not easy to earn and spend in many places. Hourly rates go down and prices go up. Connect that to the artist and where he/she lives, the price on art supplies, rent, taxes, etc.
- You Get What You Paid For: Some believe that art shouldn't be expensive to buy because: "It's art and I shouldn't pay for something high for something was done 'quickly'." There are some things that the person/client/follower should observe before they think about BUYING artwork and judging the prices that the artist is suggesting:
CHEAP + FAST = SLOPPY ARTWORK: Something that is done without any real artistic process, passion and knowledge and took little to no effort to create.
FAST + GOOD = EXPENSIVE ARTWORK: Something that is done quickly, but the artist has several years of experience and knowledge under their belt, and the expensive materials used to create the artwork.
GOOD + CHEAP = LATE ARTWORK: A piece of artwork that is well polished and detailed, but due to the low price the artist is charging, there is not much motivation to get it done in time or that it will take a while due to the amount of jobs the client has on their list.
Many artists don’t apply themselves to all that is listed above. They have their own reasons and way of doing their business. Unless they are asking for help or advice, one should not force their opinion on them on how they do business.
Those who try to help you with your pricing do not know or don't understand the way the art industry works. They think that ANYONE can just draw something and sell it. In some cases that's true and in others it's not. You need to have an understanding how art works and how to sell it. People want to buy something that looks pretty, unique and worth their finances. If it looks pretty, unique and they understand why this item is charged this amount, they will buy it.
If you wish to understand why an artist's price for their artwork is high, kindly ask them and they will tell you. If you think that the artist should RAISE their price because you feel they are underselling their artwork and talent, kindly tell them. Most times, they will be very flattered and consider it. This is better than pointing a finger at them and complaining that their prices are too high for the artwork they create. No matter how you say it, without knowing why they are charging the amount they are asking for, it will come out as insulting and rude.
I hope this has been helpful. Thank you.
artwork © 2014 Alex Cockburn
I'm sure many artists have been in similar situations: someone randomly shows up to you and flat out says "Your prices are too high" or "That is to expensive" or "You should lower your prices so other people can buy your artwork." if you reject their idea on lowering your prices, they will mostly continue to reason with you and "explain" why you should or "you will regret it". It’s much like them saying: "Believe in this because your viewpoints are way out of proportion." And if you continue to deny them or take in their idea, you will get yelled at, told down and ( sometimes ), be ridiculed in public because they believe that “they are right and you, the artist are wrong.” This has happened to me several times.
There is difference between a Professional and a Hobbyist that some seem to miss often or don’t realize. The Professional is someone who makes a living off of the artwork they make day in and day out. Every day, they work on art in order to make their dues, such as bills, food, supplies, etc. The Hobbyist is someone who only works on art for extra change to buy small items and luxuries with little to no motivation or goal in becoming professional, or they do have that goal in becoming one but are not fully driven to uptake it as a career. It is mostly just to pass the time and to make a quick buck. Many times, people who draw only for a hobby try to get me to lower my prices and/or compare their prices with mine without any second thought and most times, it comes out insulting. Basically, they talk to me like my art life is just a hobby.
Artists prices vary depending on a lot of factors: their background experience, the materials they use, the time spent working on the piece, their fame ( supply and demand ), the economy, as well as the old quote You get what you paid for.
- Background Experience: A lot of artists go to school to learn about how to create and sell. They spend years learning how to sell, what will sell, how they can improve their skills and so on. They are educated on the Do's and Don'ts of the field so they become successful artists once they graduate.
Some artists don't go to school to learn about art. Some teach themselves and others are just born with the special ability to create. From what they learned first hand on selling their artwork and the art field itself, they grow and teach themselves what works and what doesn't in order to become an artist.
- Materials: Art materials don't come cheap. They can be rather expensive to purchase. Pens, pencils, charcoal, paper, boards, frames, clay, metal, etc. Some artists go for the cheap brands of tools while others go for more expensive brands. It doesn't really matter as long as the tools work in your favor. Artists use their money that they earned to buy art supplies to continue to help them create and grow. Tools die out and new ones need to be purchased.
This doesn't just connect to pens and brushes. This also connects to electronics and accessories, much like Wacom tablets, computer screens, hard drives, etc. Digital artists spend a lot of money on equipment they need to upgrade and improve their computers and applications that will aid in their growth as artists.
- Time spent on a piece: Depending on the art piece the artist is doing, it can take from 30 minutes to months just to complete. If it is a commission, they are using up their time and energy to create something that will be suitable for the client. This also factors in waiting times, approvals, sketches, travel, etc. The artist is using their own personal time to make something for someone else. Think of it as working as a job: you are being paid by the hour to do something for someone else.
- Fame ( Supply and Demand ): There are artists who grew in popularity from the art they do. The demands for more art and commissions grow. This means more time working. At this point, they can raise their prices because they know, from the amount of fans they accumulated, that they will buy the artist's work, no matter how much it costs. Sometimes it's not like that or that simple. One cannot inquire fame so easily. It takes time and years in order to get a good amount of followers/patrons/fans/clients from the art you created. The more business you get, the better the reason to slightly increase your prices. If the price becomes too high to the point of it being unreasonable or if business is slowing down because of it, then the artist should lower their price back down until the artist requires more business. The more your artwork gets out to the public, the more business you will get. This is a sign that your artwork is worth more than what you originally priced at the beginning.
- The Economy: Do I really need to get into this bit of detail? Money is not easy to earn and spend in many places. Hourly rates go down and prices go up. Connect that to the artist and where he/she lives, the price on art supplies, rent, taxes, etc.
- You Get What You Paid For: Some believe that art shouldn't be expensive to buy because: "It's art and I shouldn't pay for something high for something was done 'quickly'." There are some things that the person/client/follower should observe before they think about BUYING artwork and judging the prices that the artist is suggesting:
CHEAP + FAST = SLOPPY ARTWORK: Something that is done without any real artistic process, passion and knowledge and took little to no effort to create.
FAST + GOOD = EXPENSIVE ARTWORK: Something that is done quickly, but the artist has several years of experience and knowledge under their belt, and the expensive materials used to create the artwork.
GOOD + CHEAP = LATE ARTWORK: A piece of artwork that is well polished and detailed, but due to the low price the artist is charging, there is not much motivation to get it done in time or that it will take a while due to the amount of jobs the client has on their list.
Many artists don’t apply themselves to all that is listed above. They have their own reasons and way of doing their business. Unless they are asking for help or advice, one should not force their opinion on them on how they do business.
Those who try to help you with your pricing do not know or don't understand the way the art industry works. They think that ANYONE can just draw something and sell it. In some cases that's true and in others it's not. You need to have an understanding how art works and how to sell it. People want to buy something that looks pretty, unique and worth their finances. If it looks pretty, unique and they understand why this item is charged this amount, they will buy it.
If you wish to understand why an artist's price for their artwork is high, kindly ask them and they will tell you. If you think that the artist should RAISE their price because you feel they are underselling their artwork and talent, kindly tell them. Most times, they will be very flattered and consider it. This is better than pointing a finger at them and complaining that their prices are too high for the artwork they create. No matter how you say it, without knowing why they are charging the amount they are asking for, it will come out as insulting and rude.
I hope this has been helpful. Thank you.
artwork © 2014 Alex Cockburn
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Okay... Maybe the "no less" is a bit "flexible". :P
But really... I've occasionally placed the first bid on a piece I really liked at a convention art auction at more than the minimum bid. Unlike me (I'm not an artist unless you count pure text), even amateur artists fund their convention trips with art sales, and I want to pay at least what I think it's worth.
I'm a proud, left-leaning liberal and not a huge believer in free-market economics for everything, but when it comes to art and other things that you don't need to live? The monetary value of a piece of art is quite literally whatever someone is willing to pay for it, no more and no less. If that someone isn't you, nobody's forcing you to buy something you think is overvalued.
But really... I've occasionally placed the first bid on a piece I really liked at a convention art auction at more than the minimum bid. Unlike me (I'm not an artist unless you count pure text), even amateur artists fund their convention trips with art sales, and I want to pay at least what I think it's worth.
I'm a proud, left-leaning liberal and not a huge believer in free-market economics for everything, but when it comes to art and other things that you don't need to live? The monetary value of a piece of art is quite literally whatever someone is willing to pay for it, no more and no less. If that someone isn't you, nobody's forcing you to buy something you think is overvalued.
yea, people need to learn to shut up and don't force their opinions or even their facts on how "better" their prices are when each artist as a different style and limits they will do and not do during commission, I seen this happen, I myself not an artist but still, I don't flat out say "your prices are too high" im willing to help out all artists as long as prices are reasonable, both for sketching, inking, coloring and labor, much as a carpenter to remodel your bathroom or bedroom, you need to pay for the materials (wood, nails, mirrors, etc.) and their laboring hours, it makes sense and as long as the job is done the way the commissioner likes it and it is done right, then there is no need to complain or be smug about.
As a Hobbyist artist myself (with no idea if my art is even worth a buck, dollar, other currency versions of a dollar), I can get behind this.
While I do think some great artist can both overprice and underprice at times, it's nice to see a professionals opinion on the matter.
While I do think some great artist can both overprice and underprice at times, it's nice to see a professionals opinion on the matter.
I completely agree.
To people bitching about art being expensive;
If you think it is too expensive, then don't buy it, but don't complain about you being too poor.
Art is worth what people are willing to pay for it. If you can't afford it, then don't pay for it, but if they are still getting enough business at that price, then the demand is high enough to justify it. If they get "TOO" much work at that price, then they can justify raising their prices.
Some people then bitch that the artist is being selfish by raising their prices "just because they can get away with it". Well it is THEIR fucking career. At the end of the day, it is a job that they are trying to live on. Some people think that they should live below the poverty line forever because they want cheap art.
TL;DR: SUPPLY AND DEMAND IS A THING!
To people bitching about art being expensive;
If you think it is too expensive, then don't buy it, but don't complain about you being too poor.
Art is worth what people are willing to pay for it. If you can't afford it, then don't pay for it, but if they are still getting enough business at that price, then the demand is high enough to justify it. If they get "TOO" much work at that price, then they can justify raising their prices.
Some people then bitch that the artist is being selfish by raising their prices "just because they can get away with it". Well it is THEIR fucking career. At the end of the day, it is a job that they are trying to live on. Some people think that they should live below the poverty line forever because they want cheap art.
TL;DR: SUPPLY AND DEMAND IS A THING!
I can't believe some people are so rude as to not only demand you lower your prices but compare your prices to others? I really hope it doesn't hurt your motivation. There will always be folks like me and all your fans who will happily pay what you value yourself for. I can't get art like yours from any other artist. You are unique and worth any price. If it is a high price, then its worth saving up for. Keep up the great work!
Easy enough to just smile and curve a bullet their direction ~
"Isn't it rather presumptuous to make suggestions about what my prices should be without having the first clue about what demand for my product is or how much time I have available to fill that demand?"
The professional has the right to be a bit direct and cocky if they've generated a strong enough support base that they have consistent demand and consistent product.
----
That being said, I now require you to provide me with $2 (4 hours) of services.
"Isn't it rather presumptuous to make suggestions about what my prices should be without having the first clue about what demand for my product is or how much time I have available to fill that demand?"
The professional has the right to be a bit direct and cocky if they've generated a strong enough support base that they have consistent demand and consistent product.
----
That being said, I now require you to provide me with $2 (4 hours) of services.
"Hobbyist is someone who only works on art for extra change to buy small items and luxuries with little to no motivation or goal in becoming a professional."
While I understand that a hobbyist may be of lower status than a professional, this does not mean they have no motivation to be a professional. I'll have to disagree on your statement.
While I understand that a hobbyist may be of lower status than a professional, this does not mean they have no motivation to be a professional. I'll have to disagree on your statement.
this isn't true, unless what your saying is don't bother with anyone but"popular"artists. I might not be best, im a learning artist, but any pics people pay me for, I do my best. this really comes across as condencending and arrogant. you cannot judge worth and quality as its the beholders eyes in where the value lies.
I think you missed the point, ookami never ever looks down on any level of artists, he's just speaking from experience... I witnessed someone going at him in exactly these words : your chibis are too expensive i can do this for 3$ ... And then go see the person's art and see for myself that yes 3$ is a fair price... Look at the image again and realise this is about those people who try to make the artist feel like shit or people that dont really realise the value of art and sell cheap stuff that a 10year old could do... btw i have a 10 year old daughter and she does sell her art at furry cons with me and people buy it, cause its cute and adorable, also i do value and tresure everything she draws it is beautiful! But I wouldnt pay her 30$ for it... Just like I wouldnt pay Ookami her 3$ for his art. It is not arrogant, it is reality, it is about fair pricing. It does not mean that cheaper art is worthing, but when it comes to $ and market value it is not the same and I don't think you can argue with that.
I can argue with you market price comment, simply by saying I have seen some of the most gifted artists on this site, charging peanuts. fa isn't market value, and I get the point of whats said, but I take offense. saying you get what you payed for is demeaning to people who charge less, and as mentioned there are amazing artists I have seen charge far less. all can charge free, I have no issues there, what someones willing to pay is fair, but to say it as so is heavily demeaning and insensitive from someone I have seen against some of the less appreciated practices of people. fair pricing is only fair if someones willing to pay, and reality isn't as you say it is, this is a personally colored opinion on a mate.
Here's one she did last year : https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd......08558696_n.jpg
She's been improving since then and she sold around 20 small badges at Furnal Equinox in Toronto Last March :)
She's been improving since then and she sold around 20 small badges at Furnal Equinox in Toronto Last March :)
I see where you are coming from, but generally saying that "cheap equals low quality", as you did with this submission, is not really fair either. I know someone on FA who charges $6 for a piece others would charge $40 for and saying that he is bad just because he wants less is quite elitist.
What you do here is basically saying that "everyone who does stuff cheaper than I do is bad at art". That may or may not have been what you wanted to say, but that's how it feels like.
What you do here is basically saying that "everyone who does stuff cheaper than I do is bad at art". That may or may not have been what you wanted to say, but that's how it feels like.
I've actually read that. I don't see how this makes the whole "charges less, is less worth" any better.
Just so you know, I actually told the person I mentioned exactly that. The reply was, paraphrased, "I chose to do that so even people with less money can get good looking commissions"
Just so you know, I actually told the person I mentioned exactly that. The reply was, paraphrased, "I chose to do that so even people with less money can get good looking commissions"
This is not about how much or how high people price something... Its about people saying its too much i can do this for this price. You charge what you want and you pay it if you really want to, if you don't wanna pay it, fair enough but don't go judging or making someone fill like shit because they charge what they charge.
On this not I salute you and will go enjoy my evening and my cup of tea. Good night sir, and let's agree to disagree if nothing else.
On this not I salute you and will go enjoy my evening and my cup of tea. Good night sir, and let's agree to disagree if nothing else.
No, I'm not saying that at all. I started off as a bad artist that charged little to nothing for my art. My main point is that artist who criticize, complain and compare ones prices to another's is just completely out. Artists, of any level, has the right to charge what they want for their time and energy, but someone who doesnt have that much experience in art criticize and compares their prices to the one who does it for a living, is just downright rude and unprofessional.
Sadly the way this community works unless you a more popular artist you are forced to undervalue your art if you want to sell it. I know a few artists now that I often pay more than their asking prices simply for that reason. A lot of this boils down to how many people know you can dictate your prices. Simply put you could be the best artist on this site, but if you're new you are going to have to undervalue yourself till you gain enough exposure to start increasing prices.
Faving this and not just for the cute pic!
As something of an "experienced" commissioner, having gotten commissions of varying prices from varying artists, I honestly don't think your prices are worth quarreling over. To me they seem fair and reasonable for the quality of art received in return. But what can one do? There's always going to be someone who "thinks they know better". Haters gunna hate. *shrug*
Keep up the fantastic work and don't ever change your prices. They're perfectly fine just the way they are. :D
As something of an "experienced" commissioner, having gotten commissions of varying prices from varying artists, I honestly don't think your prices are worth quarreling over. To me they seem fair and reasonable for the quality of art received in return. But what can one do? There's always going to be someone who "thinks they know better". Haters gunna hate. *shrug*
Keep up the fantastic work and don't ever change your prices. They're perfectly fine just the way they are. :D
Honestly, if you don't like the prices of someone, you can always just go somewhere else. x]
I mean, I love some artists stuff; but when i see triple digits on framed pieces that still look beautiful, it's that number that gives me a heart-attack.
But since I can't afford to get it, i'll just admire the works that they put out and giggle at the those that actually 'can' blow away hundreds of dollars for smut. x]
I mean, I love some artists stuff; but when i see triple digits on framed pieces that still look beautiful, it's that number that gives me a heart-attack.
But since I can't afford to get it, i'll just admire the works that they put out and giggle at the those that actually 'can' blow away hundreds of dollars for smut. x]
Welllllllllll..... while not always true, sometimes types of people are encouraged or enticed by certain price brackets. When I first started out, I had a lot more people demanding my already underpaying prices be cheaper, or many just hung around waiting for freebies. Then I stopped doing freebies and raised my prices to a move livable wage and *stuck by them* I find many who try to raise their prices FREAK OUT and drop them again in only the first few slot openings/weeks or months after trying to raise their wages. That's not good. It's hard to stick by and sometimes see a drop BUT
The people who are willing to understand, save up or try to meet your new, better, much more sane prices (assuming someone's gone from $5/hr to $min wage preferably more like $10/hr, since art site =/= art is common as a skill) tend to be...well in my experience more supportive commissioners who come back regularly and RESPECT what you do. They respect it takes money to put a roof over your head, or meds in your pets, or whatever you are using the money for (and also don't berate you for living on ramen - don't that's bad for you). I've actually gained more commissioners by raising my prices - as I'm not charging so little I *have* to be quick in order to make financial deadlines (ie more time spent, less pay = rushing to meet bills, overworked, etc) because now I can afford to allot my time better and focus better. It's *really* a win-win situation when an artist finds the sweet spot between being paid enough by the average amount of hours it takes to complete something and what people will pay. To go back to what I was saying initially, it's basically there are those out there who do believe in paying an artist fair wage - you just have to find them. They have to see your art somewhere, they have to see consistent prices (says the artist is consistent too, in a way) and then make arrangements to commission you. It may mean a huge shift in your audience, but I always tell new artists DO NOT START OFF CHEAP because transitioning from a wide audience of people who often berate and whine for freebies or 'cheapies' (ie $3 for something that took an hour) to people who won't is hard, brutal and depressing and if you *need* money, that transition time can be tough. But IT IS DOABLE! it just may open you up to some abuse :/ but seriously - bills being paid (or financial freedom & means) matters more than the opinions of those who refuse to understand those needs.
The people who are willing to understand, save up or try to meet your new, better, much more sane prices (assuming someone's gone from $5/hr to $min wage preferably more like $10/hr, since art site =/= art is common as a skill) tend to be...well in my experience more supportive commissioners who come back regularly and RESPECT what you do. They respect it takes money to put a roof over your head, or meds in your pets, or whatever you are using the money for (and also don't berate you for living on ramen - don't that's bad for you). I've actually gained more commissioners by raising my prices - as I'm not charging so little I *have* to be quick in order to make financial deadlines (ie more time spent, less pay = rushing to meet bills, overworked, etc) because now I can afford to allot my time better and focus better. It's *really* a win-win situation when an artist finds the sweet spot between being paid enough by the average amount of hours it takes to complete something and what people will pay. To go back to what I was saying initially, it's basically there are those out there who do believe in paying an artist fair wage - you just have to find them. They have to see your art somewhere, they have to see consistent prices (says the artist is consistent too, in a way) and then make arrangements to commission you. It may mean a huge shift in your audience, but I always tell new artists DO NOT START OFF CHEAP because transitioning from a wide audience of people who often berate and whine for freebies or 'cheapies' (ie $3 for something that took an hour) to people who won't is hard, brutal and depressing and if you *need* money, that transition time can be tough. But IT IS DOABLE! it just may open you up to some abuse :/ but seriously - bills being paid (or financial freedom & means) matters more than the opinions of those who refuse to understand those needs.
No worries :) You may also want to change your icon to something you've drawn - it's 'free' advertising! I've commissioned icons too - I just use them on sites that I am not trying to promote my art through (ie clicking it won't make them go "Oh that's not the artist of the art I was interested in...").
It takes work to get an audience with a good portion of willing/future clients mixed in but if you're willing to 'put your nose to the grindstone' it's attainable :D
It takes work to get an audience with a good portion of willing/future clients mixed in but if you're willing to 'put your nose to the grindstone' it's attainable :D
The problem with art is that people compare it to real life products in my opinion. There are many types of shoes, there's all-stars, Prada and some chinese made allstar lookalike. Someone can say that 'you get what you pay for' but there's a huge difference in art!
Artists struggle to get their name known and that's a process that takes years with alot of effort and drawing and determination. Unlike the example with the shoes, the art market allows an artist to become the prada among the all stars. And that's what's most respectful about art! People who don't like someone's prices have only 1 good option: To shut the fuck up. I know really famous artists that might be drawing for way too little time and charge triple the amount of an artist of greater skill than them. Should I complain? No. Why? Because both are trying to make a living, so both should deal with it themselves.
It's plainly rude to ask someone 'why are you so expensive?'. In my eyes, it's the same as asking 'why are you trying to survive?' and that's horrible.
I do wonder who would even consider your art being not worth of the money you charge! Your work, lineart, bodylanguage, vividness is remarkable and I rarely see someone with a style as unique as yours!
Artists struggle to get their name known and that's a process that takes years with alot of effort and drawing and determination. Unlike the example with the shoes, the art market allows an artist to become the prada among the all stars. And that's what's most respectful about art! People who don't like someone's prices have only 1 good option: To shut the fuck up. I know really famous artists that might be drawing for way too little time and charge triple the amount of an artist of greater skill than them. Should I complain? No. Why? Because both are trying to make a living, so both should deal with it themselves.
It's plainly rude to ask someone 'why are you so expensive?'. In my eyes, it's the same as asking 'why are you trying to survive?' and that's horrible.
I do wonder who would even consider your art being not worth of the money you charge! Your work, lineart, bodylanguage, vividness is remarkable and I rarely see someone with a style as unique as yours!
Really, while quality IS an issue, it's really more an issue of Supply and Demand. If an artist can get a comfortably-paced stream of commissions at their prices, then their prices are probably pretty appropriate. It isn't about what one person is willing to pay, or even a vocal faction of an artists personal fandom is willing to pay. It's about what enough people are willing to pay. Mostly this is just people wanting art on the cheap.
I know art supplies cost a ton of money, this is true, better quality art is given to people who pay the prices you have, not some phony artist who claims they can out-do you. I highly doubt that, as I am gonna scrape together 500 USD to commission an artist to draw something I'm willing to pay good money on, because I know they can do so. So I support you whole-heartedly.
I dont commission work verry often... almost never in fact. but when I do, I dont argue about the price. if their price is too high for me, I just dont ask that artist or I save up.. and some artists say "pay what you want" and those artists, I frequently pay more then I should. and what oyu said about price/speed/quality, is something my father has said many times about construction. I love your art though and mabey one day I will ask for a commission, but for now, I cant afford ANY commissions, and I KNOW your art is worth atleast double digits. any one that asks for a commission and then wants to argue the price, must not like the artist enough to actualy want a commission. if they DID like the artist, then they would understand the prices are more then worth it. happy easter, and I hope after seeing this post, the more.. stupid people, will stop complaining about prices.
Boiled down completely, no one has the right to tell someone else what they can charge for their art/services. The artist's success selling at those prices will be borne out by the market. Period.
If someone doesn't want to pay the fee(s), the correct action is to move on, not whine, complain or attack. Civil price negotiation (polite haggling, not civil law) is perhaps the only appropriate recourse.
If someone doesn't want to pay the fee(s), the correct action is to move on, not whine, complain or attack. Civil price negotiation (polite haggling, not civil law) is perhaps the only appropriate recourse.
There's an old engineer's maxim: "Quality, Cheap, Fast: Pick two."
Your artwork is absolutely 100% worth what you charge. The level of quality in your artwork is in the top percentile of the art found on FA. It is easily on par with many professional artists I have encountered (and I used to do 5-6 art shows a year at various conventions since the late '80's, plus being a boothie at various RenFaires, conventions, flea markets, and other venues).
You are the entrepreneur here. You are selling your wares. As such, you get to set your prices wherever you want to. Period. End of story. In fact, you have my profound respect for being both a professional artist and a successful entrepreneur selling said art for a living. These are two very different skillsets, and rarely coincide.
Your artwork is absolutely 100% worth what you charge. The level of quality in your artwork is in the top percentile of the art found on FA. It is easily on par with many professional artists I have encountered (and I used to do 5-6 art shows a year at various conventions since the late '80's, plus being a boothie at various RenFaires, conventions, flea markets, and other venues).
You are the entrepreneur here. You are selling your wares. As such, you get to set your prices wherever you want to. Period. End of story. In fact, you have my profound respect for being both a professional artist and a successful entrepreneur selling said art for a living. These are two very different skillsets, and rarely coincide.
This right here is a thing I've ranted about sooo many times before (also with a rather heavy complain about the underpricing of the furry fandom as a whole)
Every time you put out a Life's A Chibi, it's always so very accurate and wonderful! I can't wait to see the next!
Every time you put out a Life's A Chibi, it's always so very accurate and wonderful! I can't wait to see the next!
As someone who's commissioned pieces to several artists, I'd like to say a couple of things here. I personally agree with you in regards to the topic at hand, particularly the work done by professionals. Whenever I see someone that does commissions and I know they're too expensive for me at the here and now, there are two things I usually do:
1. Set aside some money so I can commission said artist when available. This allows me time to think carefully on the ideas for a commission I'd like drawn (IE A gift for a friend).
2. Wait until there is a kind of sale or auction being done for a special kind of art piece (IE An auction for a slot on a large, grand commission with several others).
1. Set aside some money so I can commission said artist when available. This allows me time to think carefully on the ideas for a commission I'd like drawn (IE A gift for a friend).
2. Wait until there is a kind of sale or auction being done for a special kind of art piece (IE An auction for a slot on a large, grand commission with several others).
Picasso was in a park when a woman approached him and asked him to draw a portrait of her. Picasso agreed and quickly sketches her. After handing the sketch to her, she is pleased with the likeness and asks how much she owed to him. Picasso replied $5,000. The woman screamed “but it took you only five minutes”. No, madam, it took me all my life, replied Picasso.
I believe most people don't understand that real art is NOT expensive. Real artists shouldn't be too cheap either. Getting art always was a privilege for people with money and that is a fact since art is created.
There are many others to do cheaper art. Even I confess I would had liked to get art from you too but I lacked a good enough theme or idea what to ask for which would be worth the time and effort.
There are many others to do cheaper art. Even I confess I would had liked to get art from you too but I lacked a good enough theme or idea what to ask for which would be worth the time and effort.
Sadly, try to ask any modern art artist about prices. Literally two colorful brushes over a dark background and a few smudges, something a small kid would to in arts and crafts class, literally, and it sells for millions.
Maybe they actually needed divine help to place those two strokes on the exact place that they needed, but, i doubt it would still worth the thousands of euros these sort of pieces cost. and people call it "real" art.
People don't really know what they want, but they do know that if they can manipulate someone into doing what they want how they want it, they will do it
Maybe they actually needed divine help to place those two strokes on the exact place that they needed, but, i doubt it would still worth the thousands of euros these sort of pieces cost. and people call it "real" art.
People don't really know what they want, but they do know that if they can manipulate someone into doing what they want how they want it, they will do it
If i could i'd favorite this 20 times in a row.
i do wish i could live out of art, or at least make a large part of my life with it, but so far life has been disgraceful with me and i am not getting anywhere ( neither with art, or any of the other things people forced me to do "to become successful in something that can be of use in life" ).
From a skill point of view i consider myself a semi-professional, as after many years i've managed to develop a certain set of skills that, while behind many people's skills, are still rather alright.
I think one of the first steps to accuire incoming work is to get famous for something you know it might sell, though, that's not an approach you can keep forever if you want to enjoy what you do and get some income out of it.
Ironicly, i've never had a large follower base, and everytime i opened myself for comissions, everyone complained the prices were too high. even when they were RIDICULOUSLY LOW and almost a gift. Nowadays knowing the answer would be the same ( as i later had the chance to know ), i just decided to ramp up the prices to something i might feel it's worth working. People still complain about my skillset not being comparable to other artists but, i am sure that now that my skill has evolved, they would have loved to get my old meaningless prices of back on the day.
... I think i derraied a little here.
My point here is. apparently customers will do whatever they want to mangle the artist around until they do their willing. And the only relatively easy way to do it is doing certain topics sone might not want to touch, but that they sadly appeal to most people for instinctual reasons.
People should not complain if something is too pricy or not, and consider that time, effort ( and for some people it might be HELL not to get your artwork destroyed before you can get it digitalized ) and that people won't do anything unless they might fell they have a reason to actually do it
...
Also as a personal observation that i had the misfortune to experiment firsthand. If you happen to know how to do many things, people might consider you, not a talented person, but a non-focused one, and they will ignore you.
i do wish i could live out of art, or at least make a large part of my life with it, but so far life has been disgraceful with me and i am not getting anywhere ( neither with art, or any of the other things people forced me to do "to become successful in something that can be of use in life" ).
From a skill point of view i consider myself a semi-professional, as after many years i've managed to develop a certain set of skills that, while behind many people's skills, are still rather alright.
I think one of the first steps to accuire incoming work is to get famous for something you know it might sell, though, that's not an approach you can keep forever if you want to enjoy what you do and get some income out of it.
Ironicly, i've never had a large follower base, and everytime i opened myself for comissions, everyone complained the prices were too high. even when they were RIDICULOUSLY LOW and almost a gift. Nowadays knowing the answer would be the same ( as i later had the chance to know ), i just decided to ramp up the prices to something i might feel it's worth working. People still complain about my skillset not being comparable to other artists but, i am sure that now that my skill has evolved, they would have loved to get my old meaningless prices of back on the day.
... I think i derraied a little here.
My point here is. apparently customers will do whatever they want to mangle the artist around until they do their willing. And the only relatively easy way to do it is doing certain topics sone might not want to touch, but that they sadly appeal to most people for instinctual reasons.
People should not complain if something is too pricy or not, and consider that time, effort ( and for some people it might be HELL not to get your artwork destroyed before you can get it digitalized ) and that people won't do anything unless they might fell they have a reason to actually do it
...
Also as a personal observation that i had the misfortune to experiment firsthand. If you happen to know how to do many things, people might consider you, not a talented person, but a non-focused one, and they will ignore you.
It's jealousy in action, of course. Your art skills are not the primary reason why you can command the prices you do. It is within the realm of possibility for there to be hobbyists who are better than you are, just as there are no doubt professionals who will make even mediocre hobbyists cringe. Your clients are paying you for your reputation, your ability to do the work you've contracted to do. When you set the prices you do, you're telling your customers that your reputation is worth this much because you've put your dues in and worked to make it worth that much.
Some people mistakenly think reputations are easy to build, that you can sit down, start scribbling out the pictures, and – poof! – people are throwing lots of money at you. On the other hand, you know from experience that a reputation has to be built up through years of patience, one art piece at a time, a lesson the aforementioned people also need to learn. Unfortunately, a few of those aforementioned deal with it poorly by trying to bully their perceived competition into lowering prices, as if that will somehow make people more inclined to throw money at them instead of someone the customer can trust.
(And it should be said, for those who might mistakenly think you're tarring hobbyists with the bully brush, most hobbyists aren't out to bully other artists into shifting their prices. After all, professionals can do the same, and most hobbyists recognize that forcing someone else to change won't make a lick of difference in building a good reputation.)
Some people mistakenly think reputations are easy to build, that you can sit down, start scribbling out the pictures, and – poof! – people are throwing lots of money at you. On the other hand, you know from experience that a reputation has to be built up through years of patience, one art piece at a time, a lesson the aforementioned people also need to learn. Unfortunately, a few of those aforementioned deal with it poorly by trying to bully their perceived competition into lowering prices, as if that will somehow make people more inclined to throw money at them instead of someone the customer can trust.
(And it should be said, for those who might mistakenly think you're tarring hobbyists with the bully brush, most hobbyists aren't out to bully other artists into shifting their prices. After all, professionals can do the same, and most hobbyists recognize that forcing someone else to change won't make a lick of difference in building a good reputation.)
I've no experience as an artist, but I do as a customer and I have to agree on the statement "You get what you pay for." Not just on quality of art, but quality of artist. As well as the three points that you've made regarding speed, quality and price, there's a fourth point that I've come across in terms of paying, and that's the artist's attitude towards their customers. This has probably been bought up elsewhere in the (currently) 75 other comments, but that's a lot to go through X3
As well as looking over prices and the quality of an artist's work and their style, I also look carefully through their ToS, not just for their policies regarding commissioning, but also at the wording. Particularly, artists that believe that they're the ones in command fully when they should be working with a commissioner. For me, attitude has a big impact on whether I decide that I'm going to approach somebody, more so than quality or price ever could. I've had artists that I've commissioned miss stuff off of ToS regarding WiPs and changes to work, only to bite back at me when I note that something in a piece that I've paid for is not as I asked for it and proclaim themselves as top dog because they're the ones doing the art and that my, the commissioner's opinion is invalid. And as unfortunate as it is, one customer leaving them isn't going to affect them. Countless other people are going to flock to them.
But it taught me a lesson, that I should carefully consider an artist's attitude before approaching, and that if everything seems good from the outside, in price, quality and speed, I might be paying in other ways. As others have mentioned about reputation, that reputation is only good outside of the base that knows you, if the people inside know you as a dirtbag, then you're going to lose otherwise loyal customers that would happily keep coming back and paying more for your work, even if you're only budding.
That's my own proverbial two cents. *leaves them in a collection jar*
As well as looking over prices and the quality of an artist's work and their style, I also look carefully through their ToS, not just for their policies regarding commissioning, but also at the wording. Particularly, artists that believe that they're the ones in command fully when they should be working with a commissioner. For me, attitude has a big impact on whether I decide that I'm going to approach somebody, more so than quality or price ever could. I've had artists that I've commissioned miss stuff off of ToS regarding WiPs and changes to work, only to bite back at me when I note that something in a piece that I've paid for is not as I asked for it and proclaim themselves as top dog because they're the ones doing the art and that my, the commissioner's opinion is invalid. And as unfortunate as it is, one customer leaving them isn't going to affect them. Countless other people are going to flock to them.
But it taught me a lesson, that I should carefully consider an artist's attitude before approaching, and that if everything seems good from the outside, in price, quality and speed, I might be paying in other ways. As others have mentioned about reputation, that reputation is only good outside of the base that knows you, if the people inside know you as a dirtbag, then you're going to lose otherwise loyal customers that would happily keep coming back and paying more for your work, even if you're only budding.
That's my own proverbial two cents. *leaves them in a collection jar*
It's simple micro econ. Price controls demand. You should set your price to be such that you get exactly as much demand as you want.
I see too often artists who enjoy having low prices, but then fret when they open up to commissions and the list fills up so quickly. That is clear sign of prices too low. If you are making art constantly, your price should be such that you've got 1-2 waiting at all times. If you're a hobbyist it just comes down to how many you want to do.
Everyone is free to set their own business model. If someone wants to do what amounts to charity work, they can do that. If someone wants to charge prices as if their art belongs in a museum, they can do that. The free market decides what works. People shouldn't waste time complaining, it contributes nothing. Speak with your wallet, not with your mouth.
I see too often artists who enjoy having low prices, but then fret when they open up to commissions and the list fills up so quickly. That is clear sign of prices too low. If you are making art constantly, your price should be such that you've got 1-2 waiting at all times. If you're a hobbyist it just comes down to how many you want to do.
Everyone is free to set their own business model. If someone wants to do what amounts to charity work, they can do that. If someone wants to charge prices as if their art belongs in a museum, they can do that. The free market decides what works. People shouldn't waste time complaining, it contributes nothing. Speak with your wallet, not with your mouth.
I honestly look for the 'Good Work, Cheap Price' category. The art I'm getting isn't deadline to some fancy project and isn't life threatening to me, so they can take their time. I've waited months for art and have enjoyed the results to this day.
Then again, I suppose some people can't wait. Price is what will always snag me. I care not for quality half the time, because even a shitty artist can plop out something now and then that's above their skill level. We all can't judge, we can only do.
Then again, I suppose some people can't wait. Price is what will always snag me. I care not for quality half the time, because even a shitty artist can plop out something now and then that's above their skill level. We all can't judge, we can only do.
Completely understand and agree. Several years ago, I used to write furry and transformation material on commission. But when I raised my 'per word' rate, I got a lot of complaining and such. But TIME is literally money to me now. As much as I enjoy 'fun' writing, I need to devote my time to the material that pays... Like technical writing, for example.
Considering the professional level of your work, and the time constraints I suspect you're under due to numerous projects, I think your prices are more than fair.
So, well said :)
Considering the professional level of your work, and the time constraints I suspect you're under due to numerous projects, I think your prices are more than fair.
So, well said :)
I agree with this entirely. Why should those who do art as a living have to lower their prices for some smuck online who only cares about getting their art/porn for the cheapest they can get it for off that person? Art supplies cost money, bills, food, internet, these also cost money. An artist's prices reflect what they have to pay for. People should be happy that they do not have to pay INDUSTRY STANDARD PRICES. A standard line art drawing from an industry member will cost you about $500 for a small but high quality print. If this was in color, the price can jump to $2k depending on the level of detail, size of the image and who you go to to create it. So furs who complain about artist prices should not unless people want to make them shut up by slamming them with industry prices. Be glad for the lower prices and remember that time is money people!
I was going to say that I agree fully with you, but when I read this, it doesn't sound neither correct or nice:
"The Hobbyist is someone who only works on art for extra change to buy small items and luxuries with little to no motivation or goal in becoming professional, or they do have that goal in becoming one but are not fully driven to uptake it as a career. It is mostly just to pass the time and to make a quick buck. Many times, people who draw only for a hobby try to get me to lower my prices and/or compare their prices with mine without any second thought and most times, it comes out insulting. Basically, they talk to me like my art life is just a hobby."
I can only say that this is absolutely not correct, nor accurate. Artist aren't either "professional" or "hobbyists", there's a shitload of different types of artists, you know? Each one is a whole different world if we compare each other (Thing I don't encourage to do, it's not worth nor fair), and marking them like that isn't good at all, even if you're trying to be general.
I consider myself an in-training artist, atm I draw because I love it, and I'm training so, in the future, I can go to the university to learn more. I can assure you I consider myself both "professional" and "hobbyist", because I draw because I love it, and I can earn soem money with it, but I simply don't focus on that. Saying that someone who takes art as a hobby isn't professional, has no motivation to improve and only wants a few quick bucks is just going to the wrong side of things. There are artists like that? I'm sure! but not every artist that is not a "profesional" is like that.
I can understand your point of view, you're mad because you've been asked several times that you're too expensive, well, tell those guys to fuck off, but don't put all of us artists into the same sack!
Appart of that point, I fully agree with the rest of your statement. Quality (most of the times) requires both experience and a price to pay for it, nearly nothing is free nowadays. If someone's bitching for that price being "too high for them", they can either go to fuck off, or earn the money that art really is worth.
You don't talk about it, mostly because of the own topic, but comparing artists doesn't end up well, it rarely (pretty much never) does. Each artist gather their own experience as they draw, that's what makes them "better". Comparing to someone who has more experience than you only causes to lower one's own status. They're not "better or worse", they have more or less experience than you~
Ops... I hope I didn't write too much
"The Hobbyist is someone who only works on art for extra change to buy small items and luxuries with little to no motivation or goal in becoming professional, or they do have that goal in becoming one but are not fully driven to uptake it as a career. It is mostly just to pass the time and to make a quick buck. Many times, people who draw only for a hobby try to get me to lower my prices and/or compare their prices with mine without any second thought and most times, it comes out insulting. Basically, they talk to me like my art life is just a hobby."
I can only say that this is absolutely not correct, nor accurate. Artist aren't either "professional" or "hobbyists", there's a shitload of different types of artists, you know? Each one is a whole different world if we compare each other (Thing I don't encourage to do, it's not worth nor fair), and marking them like that isn't good at all, even if you're trying to be general.
I consider myself an in-training artist, atm I draw because I love it, and I'm training so, in the future, I can go to the university to learn more. I can assure you I consider myself both "professional" and "hobbyist", because I draw because I love it, and I can earn soem money with it, but I simply don't focus on that. Saying that someone who takes art as a hobby isn't professional, has no motivation to improve and only wants a few quick bucks is just going to the wrong side of things. There are artists like that? I'm sure! but not every artist that is not a "profesional" is like that.
I can understand your point of view, you're mad because you've been asked several times that you're too expensive, well, tell those guys to fuck off, but don't put all of us artists into the same sack!
Appart of that point, I fully agree with the rest of your statement. Quality (most of the times) requires both experience and a price to pay for it, nearly nothing is free nowadays. If someone's bitching for that price being "too high for them", they can either go to fuck off, or earn the money that art really is worth.
You don't talk about it, mostly because of the own topic, but comparing artists doesn't end up well, it rarely (pretty much never) does. Each artist gather their own experience as they draw, that's what makes them "better". Comparing to someone who has more experience than you only causes to lower one's own status. They're not "better or worse", they have more or less experience than you~
Ops... I hope I didn't write too much
http://dokimajesticswan.deviantart......ices-447550297
I know it's not from FA it's self but for any art site like this OR DA it's the same problem. There will always be people who complain about the pricing no matter what the price is high or low. I've seen people complain that a dollar was to expensive and that it should be lower.
It's ok for someone to say "NO" if they don't agree. but to constantly harass, demand and try to force another to change isn't ok no matter what situation. A lot of artists these sites are the only places they have a name for themselves and where they can sell their art. Yes they could have the town they live in the group of friends they have might buy from them or a school might ask them to do a piece for a cause. BUT here in the online world and where most artist are they are able to expand their customers and friends who might even be able to help them more and expand where they sell (conventions, small art fair markets etc)
What pricing should and shouldn't be is a topic on it's self, from what i see from this (as a personal view) is the basic respect people are showing (or not showing) towards a person's choice. Again going back to being able to tell someone "no"
I know it's not from FA it's self but for any art site like this OR DA it's the same problem. There will always be people who complain about the pricing no matter what the price is high or low. I've seen people complain that a dollar was to expensive and that it should be lower.
It's ok for someone to say "NO" if they don't agree. but to constantly harass, demand and try to force another to change isn't ok no matter what situation. A lot of artists these sites are the only places they have a name for themselves and where they can sell their art. Yes they could have the town they live in the group of friends they have might buy from them or a school might ask them to do a piece for a cause. BUT here in the online world and where most artist are they are able to expand their customers and friends who might even be able to help them more and expand where they sell (conventions, small art fair markets etc)
What pricing should and shouldn't be is a topic on it's self, from what i see from this (as a personal view) is the basic respect people are showing (or not showing) towards a person's choice. Again going back to being able to tell someone "no"
Style and connections also help with income.
And so do people who tip and pitch in an extra few bucks out of kindness or with reason! I know I've done it a few times - 3 times, actually. Those reasons included supporting a college student, sometimes as a thank-you, or even because I feel bad about having an artist do 6-8 revisions during the rough sketch cause I was picky on how the head and facial expression looked.
I usually do it out of kindness. :)
And so do people who tip and pitch in an extra few bucks out of kindness or with reason! I know I've done it a few times - 3 times, actually. Those reasons included supporting a college student, sometimes as a thank-you, or even because I feel bad about having an artist do 6-8 revisions during the rough sketch cause I was picky on how the head and facial expression looked.
I usually do it out of kindness. :)
What many don't seem to be aware of is that pretty much all artists on FA seriously undersell themselves when compared to industry standards prices.
And also that art is a luxury just like a fancy sports car or a diamond ring...
You wouldn't go into a ferrari dealership as a car mechanic and complain about their prices and claim you could build a similar car 10 times cheaper than they can, would you? It's just rude.
And also that art is a luxury just like a fancy sports car or a diamond ring...
You wouldn't go into a ferrari dealership as a car mechanic and complain about their prices and claim you could build a similar car 10 times cheaper than they can, would you? It's just rude.
i'd like you to know, from one artistic professional to another, I beleive you're underselling yourself and The jerks who are telling you otherwise can kiss it. Keep up the good work, as someone who supports herself, and comfortably, on an income that is exclusively commissions I hope you can one day reach a price bracket where these jerks are behind you. (also i find your black and white detail cross hatching absolutely lovely, + watch from me dearie.)
I don't even have to read through the whole desc to know what you mean. Also, when(if) I have the money, and now having discovered you, I so will get a foofy cuteness image done. It's worth it.
Personal preference too; I just stumbled across your side from someone else's commission gotten by you, and you're near 100% Cute in each page of artwork you have. Right up there with ToonFX who I also think has a super style, though in a different way. Annnd (don't mean to mix or confuse you with hornypages, I admit I'm a deviant too besides liking cute), it's awesome to see so much of the things I adore in just about all your images. Annnnd again, not to say you shouldn't (I also apologize too much ;), seeing the same appeal in each image, instead of wide-spread artists where I may find the occasional 'oh, that's extra _me_, I'll save that one!', here I can just look about and roll around in the sea of adorable fluff images.
You go! And here's wishing your prices keep you afloat, for having you need to take more time off drawing to make ends meet would be a great loss. ^.^
Personal preference too; I just stumbled across your side from someone else's commission gotten by you, and you're near 100% Cute in each page of artwork you have. Right up there with ToonFX who I also think has a super style, though in a different way. Annnd (don't mean to mix or confuse you with hornypages, I admit I'm a deviant too besides liking cute), it's awesome to see so much of the things I adore in just about all your images. Annnnd again, not to say you shouldn't (I also apologize too much ;), seeing the same appeal in each image, instead of wide-spread artists where I may find the occasional 'oh, that's extra _me_, I'll save that one!', here I can just look about and roll around in the sea of adorable fluff images.
You go! And here's wishing your prices keep you afloat, for having you need to take more time off drawing to make ends meet would be a great loss. ^.^
My option on this is: charge what you feel your art is worth and let others charge what they think their art is worth. If you don't like an artist charges, don't commission them. Your not buying a tv or a car your buying something unique and creative that someone took the time, energy and frustration to make, if that's not worth paying a little extra for what is?
Some people are just budgeted. Like me, my absolute cap on an art piece is $50, I don't want to spend any more than that on a singular piece of art. This isn't saying I don't think you're not worth your price, but it's out of my range and I just need to look somewhere else .3. And to be fair, there is a market to go for the more budgeted commissioners, so opening up cheaper prices can benefeit if you advertise correctly (influx of more people who pay less might pay off more than a couple people who pay more, but that's entirely one's call on how to do it).
If I got super good at drawing and opened commissions, I'd probably stay cheap because I do this as a hobby, though maybe I'd charge more for some types of shading because that's super time consuming for me.
If I got super good at drawing and opened commissions, I'd probably stay cheap because I do this as a hobby, though maybe I'd charge more for some types of shading because that's super time consuming for me.
And then we have those porn YCH auctions that spike to four hundred dollars for a flats digital. I always find those amusing.
There are artists I look at and think to myself "Hey, I'd love to get a commission from that person but his/her prices are far inflated probably due to the fact that s/he's popular and people are willing to pay for the prestige of owning artwork from that person. I wish they'd lower the price to what I feel is reasonable." but I can see each persons viewpoints.
There are artists I look at and think to myself "Hey, I'd love to get a commission from that person but his/her prices are far inflated probably due to the fact that s/he's popular and people are willing to pay for the prestige of owning artwork from that person. I wish they'd lower the price to what I feel is reasonable." but I can see each persons viewpoints.
the real hobbyist does what they like, charges nothing for it, and gets more out of doing so, then anything that could be bought or sold.
people frequently get less then what they paw for. seldom more, though that CAN happen too.
people don't see when they don't look, and the don't look when they are too mentally lazy to do so because they've become too used to thinking in terms of little green pieces of paper, which in the end, are neither happy, unhappy, nor particularly rewarding.
nature charges nothing but effort, and that, often less then what worshipers of symoblic value believe they get something out of wanting everyone to believe.
people frequently get less then what they paw for. seldom more, though that CAN happen too.
people don't see when they don't look, and the don't look when they are too mentally lazy to do so because they've become too used to thinking in terms of little green pieces of paper, which in the end, are neither happy, unhappy, nor particularly rewarding.
nature charges nothing but effort, and that, often less then what worshipers of symoblic value believe they get something out of wanting everyone to believe.
i maybe come to late to add some comment "here" but the main base of that what you said is true.
But let me explain the "opinion" i learned and saw in eyes of the artist AND the one who "maybe" buy the art or thought abotu to do so.
So as sample now~
I saw your prices and honestly, i gulbed and thought "WOHO, thats kinda expensive." (as i said SAMPLE, dont think now i wana go real now), of course, at the first view it is expensive - i mean hey, 65$ for "just" a flat art? i can buy me 2 3DS games for that or even other good stuff i have longer something from. I know a lot other artists who whould draw me even a full color picture in its own style for just 25$ and i love this artists art even more than this ones here so why should i pay 65$ for a flat art here? COMPLAIN, DISLIKE, WTF knows.
thats for the sample of the guys who think only with the first view so let me add some real things now.
First, it is right, 65$ is MAYBE a high price but people need to understand the work behind. Its not like "I fucked some lines on paper and make a price on it", no. Some people make it as job, others for hobby. SO they add material costs + work time into a price which is for the "Most" artists kinda a good price system. as sample, if you say "my art looks good and i need 4 hours for a flat picture + script and time...lets make it short and keep it 65$. this should work." its fine. It is even fine for me if you do so. Most people just dont get it what a picture NEEDS time and work behind. Of course it gives maybe other artists out there which cheeper prices but you cant compare your style with another artist - only if the other artist draws EXACTLY like you - like 1:1 copy (which will be never happen i guess).
In the other hand the artist should see in the guys who maybe complain and SEE this reasons. A lot people, maybe even people who really enjoy the art from you (or other artists), liks your art work but cant see a reason why to pay that high prices. Artist shouldnt be jerks and just say "I MAKE MY PRICES AS HIGH AS I WISH! BUY THEM OR GTFO!" (to be honest, i had some artists which react exactly like that...). Artists should explain that people why they are so high and not punch them in the face for maybe a bit "complain" about. If that people know someone who does it for 25bucks, its nice for them. if they complain about your high prices, explain them a picture needs work. If they say i could buy 2 3DS games for that price, ask which games. An artist should be kind sometimes (i know its sometimes HARD as hell) with those people coz that people are more just for troll you and only complain, people who really wants your art maybe wana only know more, they run around with a "?" over the head and needs to know more.
One sample, i dont wana make advetising for me dont worry (also i cant compair my art with yours honestly...), if someone whould ask me why i have high prices (lol i dont even take commissions X3) i whould explain him that i need to buy my stuff to draw with also i need a lot time to work on a good looking picture.
JUST one bad thing should never be happen between an artist and guy who buys the art - this "your not on my LEVEL" thing. Its one which people mostly understand totaly wrong, also which really sounds like you wana keep peoples art below yours. Its kinda "not fair" to say "your art is not my level" which sounds more like "PFFF what a noob you are! learn to draw dude!". this Level thing is really a thing I (honeslty) dislike the most. People (artists and Costumers) even try to compair the artwork from each other and "build" up his/her own Level - but honestly, NOONE can COMPAIR artwork from each other, just everyone have his/her OWN style and thats it. This LEVEL thing should be really "destroyed", a lot people just dislike it if people even use it, it jerks people of and for the most of them its even a punch in the face AND a reason more not to buy art from the artist or even draw better. Just dont use it. :3
You see, it gives people who maybe just need some info, in the other hand maybe some even wana buy your art but only asking you WHY i should pay you that without knowing the reasons of the price. Just dont jerk them of, better be kind sometimes and explain why you have your prices. Its your art and your work. People get that what they pay for IF they see a reason why it is worth the price. ^-
I hope you got that and thanks for reading, i know i talked a lot...
But let me explain the "opinion" i learned and saw in eyes of the artist AND the one who "maybe" buy the art or thought abotu to do so.
So as sample now~
I saw your prices and honestly, i gulbed and thought "WOHO, thats kinda expensive." (as i said SAMPLE, dont think now i wana go real now), of course, at the first view it is expensive - i mean hey, 65$ for "just" a flat art? i can buy me 2 3DS games for that or even other good stuff i have longer something from. I know a lot other artists who whould draw me even a full color picture in its own style for just 25$ and i love this artists art even more than this ones here so why should i pay 65$ for a flat art here? COMPLAIN, DISLIKE, WTF knows.
thats for the sample of the guys who think only with the first view so let me add some real things now.
First, it is right, 65$ is MAYBE a high price but people need to understand the work behind. Its not like "I fucked some lines on paper and make a price on it", no. Some people make it as job, others for hobby. SO they add material costs + work time into a price which is for the "Most" artists kinda a good price system. as sample, if you say "my art looks good and i need 4 hours for a flat picture + script and time...lets make it short and keep it 65$. this should work." its fine. It is even fine for me if you do so. Most people just dont get it what a picture NEEDS time and work behind. Of course it gives maybe other artists out there which cheeper prices but you cant compare your style with another artist - only if the other artist draws EXACTLY like you - like 1:1 copy (which will be never happen i guess).
In the other hand the artist should see in the guys who maybe complain and SEE this reasons. A lot people, maybe even people who really enjoy the art from you (or other artists), liks your art work but cant see a reason why to pay that high prices. Artist shouldnt be jerks and just say "I MAKE MY PRICES AS HIGH AS I WISH! BUY THEM OR GTFO!" (to be honest, i had some artists which react exactly like that...). Artists should explain that people why they are so high and not punch them in the face for maybe a bit "complain" about. If that people know someone who does it for 25bucks, its nice for them. if they complain about your high prices, explain them a picture needs work. If they say i could buy 2 3DS games for that price, ask which games. An artist should be kind sometimes (i know its sometimes HARD as hell) with those people coz that people are more just for troll you and only complain, people who really wants your art maybe wana only know more, they run around with a "?" over the head and needs to know more.
One sample, i dont wana make advetising for me dont worry (also i cant compair my art with yours honestly...), if someone whould ask me why i have high prices (lol i dont even take commissions X3) i whould explain him that i need to buy my stuff to draw with also i need a lot time to work on a good looking picture.
JUST one bad thing should never be happen between an artist and guy who buys the art - this "your not on my LEVEL" thing. Its one which people mostly understand totaly wrong, also which really sounds like you wana keep peoples art below yours. Its kinda "not fair" to say "your art is not my level" which sounds more like "PFFF what a noob you are! learn to draw dude!". this Level thing is really a thing I (honeslty) dislike the most. People (artists and Costumers) even try to compair the artwork from each other and "build" up his/her own Level - but honestly, NOONE can COMPAIR artwork from each other, just everyone have his/her OWN style and thats it. This LEVEL thing should be really "destroyed", a lot people just dislike it if people even use it, it jerks people of and for the most of them its even a punch in the face AND a reason more not to buy art from the artist or even draw better. Just dont use it. :3
You see, it gives people who maybe just need some info, in the other hand maybe some even wana buy your art but only asking you WHY i should pay you that without knowing the reasons of the price. Just dont jerk them of, better be kind sometimes and explain why you have your prices. Its your art and your work. People get that what they pay for IF they see a reason why it is worth the price. ^-
I hope you got that and thanks for reading, i know i talked a lot...
I can understand strongly what you are trying to say. Praises the amazing artist.
This makes me question what am I? When I was young, I draw like crazy about mythological things of fantasy and monsters. When shown techniques and skills to improve it just pushed me away. I draw for the enjoyment and I don't sell my work. So what does this make me?
This makes me question what am I? When I was young, I draw like crazy about mythological things of fantasy and monsters. When shown techniques and skills to improve it just pushed me away. I draw for the enjoyment and I don't sell my work. So what does this make me?
For you, art is a hobby. You draw for the joy of just drawing without profit. That's not a bad thing at all. Many draw just because its a hobby and it makes them happy. Others draw because its a job ( doesn't mean they are miserableness ). If you wish to start making art for money, take art courses to define your style and techniques until you feel you are ready to sell your work for profit. If that takes off, continue down the path if you still enjoy drawing. If it doesnt take off, still draw for the pleasure of it
Just like the well-known quote from Full Metal Alchemist:
'Humankind cannot obtain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. That is alchemy's first rule of Equivalent Exchange.'
If only this was true, but unfortunately it's not always the case. The reason I say that is because last year, I spent $1750 on a fursuit from a fursuit maker. I, of course, expected to receive a fursuit that was equivalent to what I had paid. And lo and behold, my fursuit was crafted very poorly and it was rushed. It was NOT worth the $1750 that I paid for it and they refuse to pay me back anything.
So while everyone wants it to be true, you will not always get your money's worth on what you buy. Also, if you're wondering about how my fursuit turned out poorly, then you can find it on my profile page.
'Humankind cannot obtain anything without first giving something in return. To obtain, something of equal value must be lost. That is alchemy's first rule of Equivalent Exchange.'
If only this was true, but unfortunately it's not always the case. The reason I say that is because last year, I spent $1750 on a fursuit from a fursuit maker. I, of course, expected to receive a fursuit that was equivalent to what I had paid. And lo and behold, my fursuit was crafted very poorly and it was rushed. It was NOT worth the $1750 that I paid for it and they refuse to pay me back anything.
So while everyone wants it to be true, you will not always get your money's worth on what you buy. Also, if you're wondering about how my fursuit turned out poorly, then you can find it on my profile page.
in reality, when everything is made to be about money, you are very very lucky to ever get anywhere close to as much as you pay for it.
in terms of real value, rather then symbols representing it, nature and the universe come considerably closer to the presumed and optimal balance.
why there should be entropic loss in imaginary systems is a matter i have not looked into closely, nor very much wish to.
i am of course aware of ego/psychology accounting for it at least partially.
in terms of real value, rather then symbols representing it, nature and the universe come considerably closer to the presumed and optimal balance.
why there should be entropic loss in imaginary systems is a matter i have not looked into closely, nor very much wish to.
i am of course aware of ego/psychology accounting for it at least partially.
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